kim

just had to share (video) http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-03-27/im-not-stupid-monsanto-lobbyist-refuses-drink-weedkiller-after-proclaiming-it-wont-h fail regularly???

monarchcat, This will give you a some information on why it might not be wise to allow no rise in temp (of course you don't want the fever to get too high either). I think this points out that a high fever can be a sign that things are going south. http://www.whale.to/a/butler_chickenpox.html Vit A & C and a little selenium, supporting the liver (low protein/sugar/ lot of fluids) as it deals with handling the toxins that the pox produce, are things that I believe are important. This sure isn't medical advise but what I believe would be the "go to," treatments for chickenpox at our house. One of my kids had really low neutrophils during a high fever illness and those first responders or the innate immune response is important in dealing with CP, so these things make sense to me. Easy reading short article here http://www.livestrong.com/article/362153-what-vitamins-are-needed-to-increase-white-blood-cells/ The video on this page, about 1/3 of the way down, is really worth watching if you want to make yourself feel better about not doing the 2nd CP vaccine. It's also scary and maddening in the respect of no vaccine that you could even sort of feel good about for an alternative for an older person who is at greater risk of complications or for a person with autoimmune/hyperinflammatory concerns. Video presentation by Dr.Theresa Deisher: Skip forward 21 minutes to the important part of the talk. Dr Theresa Deisher – Worldwide Autism Epidemic & Human Fetal Manufactured Contaminated Vaccines Published on Sep 10, 2014 http://jeffreydachmd.com/2015/02/greater-threat-measles-measles-vaccine/ Please keep us posted on how they're doing!

I sure understand where he's coming from, but you might want to have your husband read this study http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0101257 Antibiotic Treatment Attenuates Behavioral and Neurochemical Changes Induced by Exposure of Rats to Group A Streptococcal Antigenexcerpt (added bolding) The finding that ampicillin treatment reduces some of the deleterious behavioral effects of exposure to GAS is in line with the clinical observation that antibiotic treatment throughout childhood is effective in reducing relapse of SC [5], [10]. In the rat model, antibiotic treatment was effective even though there are no live GAS bacteria, and was not dependent on a reduction in the level of anti-GAS IgG in the sera. Interestingly, in the clinic, antibiotic treatment has been reported to be effective even in patients with low bacterial titers, suggesting that antibiotics may act on more than just the throat bacteria [6]. The prophylactic action of antibiotics may be achieved by their immunomodulatory effects [32] or by their neuroprotective effects.

eamom, I am involved in my state at a local and state level. While working on all of this, the concerns AW refers to about the resurgence of measles has not been lost on me. I have a fear of varicella and measles particularly for autoimmune prone and OLDER age of onset. My kids got their first MMR at 12 mos. Again, parents are left in a horrible position here, for ourselves and our children. Thanks for posting I'm probably going to edit this down to just the links, but I found this information concerning. All bolding mine Volume 16, Issue 20, December 1998, Pages 2052–2057 http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0264410X98000814 Abstract Vaccine-induced measles virus antibodies after two doses of combined measles, mumps and rubella vaccine: a 12-year follow-up in two cohorts In Finland, a two-dose vaccination programme against measles, mumps and rubella (MMR) was begun in 1982. The programme with high coverage (97–98%) has eliminated these three diseases from Finland. The aim of the present study was to follow up the kinetics of measles virus antibodies in MMR vaccinated cohorts. We have followed the kinetics of measles virus antibody levels induced by vaccination in the same individuals immunized with their first MMR vaccine in 1982. After 12 years 80% of the original children remained available for sampling. Antibodies to measles virus were measured by haemagglutination inhibition (HI) and plaque reduction neutralization (NT) techniques. The primary dose induced 99.4% seroconversion for measles with a geometric mean HI antibody titre (GMT) of (±219), equivalent to 4304 mIU (milli-International Units) ml-1 in group A. The 12-year follow-up specimens showed a measles seropositivity rate of 100% as assayed with the HI and NT tests with a mean HI antibody titre of (±54), equivalent to 624 mIU ml-1. The vaccination-induced measles virus antibodies decline in the absence of natural booster infections. It is important to follow how long the protection achieved by the present vaccine programme will last after elimination of indigenous measles. http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/132/5/e1126.full Measles in Children Vaccinated With 2 Doses of MMR OBJECTIVE: A previous measles outbreak investigation in a high school in Quebec, Canada identified 2-dose vaccine effectiveness of 94%. The risk of measles in 2-dose recipients was significantly higher (2–4 times) when measles vaccine was first administered at 12 versus =15 months of age, with no significant effect of the age at second dose. Generalizability of this association was also assessed in the expanded provincial data set of notified cases. METHODS: This matched case–control study included only 2-dose recipients. All confirmed (laboratory or epidemiologically linked) cases in patients aged 5 to 17 years were included. Each case was matched to 5 controls. RESULTS: A total of 102 cases and 510 controls were included; 89% of cases were in patients 13 to 17 years old. When the first dose was administered at 12 to 13 months compared with =15 months of age, the risk of measles in participants outside the outbreak school was 6 times higher (95% confidence interval, 1.33–29.3) and was 5.2 times higher (95% confidence interval, 1.91–14.3) in the pooled estimate (participants from the outbreak school + outside that school). CONCLUSIONS: A significantly greater risk of measles among 2-dose recipients whose first dose was given at 12 to 13 months rather than =15 months of age is confirmed in the larger Quebec data set. The mechanism remains unknown, but vaccine failures in 2-dose recipients could have substantial implications for measles elimination efforts through 2-dose vaccination. The optimal age at first dose may warrant additional evaluation. 3rd paragraph under discussion A pooled fivefold greater risk of measles among those whose first MMR dose was administered at 12 to 13 vs =15 months is concerning, especially in the context of measles elimination efforts that require high levels of immunity. Previous serologic studies7,10,22–26 based on age at first dose are consistent with our epidemiologic observations. Although caution is needed in the interpretation of immunogenicity findings based on laboratory, assay, and protective thresholds applied, serologic studies have shown that early age at first dose leaves an imprint that affects both the immediate second-dose antibody response and persistence. Children first vaccinated at 12 months compared with =13 months are less likely to seroconvert after reimmunization and to have significantly lower antibody levels.10 This phenomenon has also been noted in children vaccinated younger than 12 months.7,22,23 Children without detectable plaque reduction neutralization antibody after a first dose responded to revaccination with a primary-type response and maintained antibody titers after revaccination above levels believed to be protective, whereas revaccination of children with low levels of plaque reduction neutralization antibody induced a secondary-type response, with antibodies returning rapidly to levels below protective threshold.24 In Germany, among ~7000 2-dose recipients, the proportion without detectable antibodies decreased steadily with older age at first dose to reach a nadir between 18 and 23 months.25 The proportion seronegative also increased with time since the second dose, and the proportion seronegative =6 years after the second dose was similar to that observed in single-dose recipients.25 Similarly, in the United States, increased antibody titers in response to a second MMR dose rapidly returned to prebooster levels, and most subjects (72%, 13/18) with low titers 10 years after boosting were also in the lowest quartile for antibodies before boost.26 This “return” to the level of protection afforded by the first dose based on time elapsed since the second dose is consistent with the similar VE we observed after 1 or 2 doses (95.9% vs 94.2%, respectively) during our recent school outbreak investigation.15 and Conclusions Although unvaccinated people should remain the prime target for measles vaccination, the unexpected vulnerability we have identified in twice-vaccinated people could ultimately lead to failed measles elimination efforts. If the effect of early vaccination permanently alters the ability to respond to subsequent doses, even adding a third or fourth dose may not provide long-lasting protection. Therefore, it is critical to understand the mechanisms of primary vaccine failure or loss of vaccine protection that our findings may signal. http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=40001&fileId=S0950268899003222 Epidemiology and Infection Epidemiology and Infection / Volume 124 / Issue 02 / April 2000, pp 263-271 Abstract Failure to seroconvert (primary vaccine failure) is believed to be the principal reason (approx. > 95%) why some vaccinees remain susceptible to measles and is often attributed to the persistence of maternal antibodies in children vaccinated at a young age. Avidity testing is able to separate primary from secondary vaccine failures (waning and/or incomplete immunity), but has not been utilized in measles epidemiology. Low-avidity (LA) and high-avidity (HA) virus-specific IgG antibodies indicate primary and secondary failure, respectively. Measles vaccine failures (n = 142; mean age 10·1 years, range 2–22 years) from an outbreak in 1988–9 in Finland were tested for measles–virus IgG avidity using a protein denaturating EIA. Severity of measles was recorded in 89 failures and 169 non-vaccinees (mean age 16·2 years, range 2–22 years). The patients with HA antibodies (n = 28) tended to have clinically mild measles and rapid IgG response. Among failures vaccinated at < 12, 12–15 and > 15 months of age with single doses of Schwarz-strain vaccine in the 1970s, 50 (95% CI 1–99), 36 (CI 16–56) and 25% (CI 8–42) had HA antibodies, respectively. When a single measles, mumps and rubella (MMR) vaccine had been given after 1982 at 15 months of age, only 7% (CI 0–14) showed HA antibodies. Omitting re-vaccinees and those vaccinated at < 15 months, Schwarz-strain recipients had 3·6 (CI 1·1–11·5) higher occurrence of HA responses compared to MMR recipients. Apart from one municipality, where even re-vaccinees had high risk of primary infection, 89% (CI 69 to [similar] 100) of the infected re-vaccinees had an HA response. Secondary measles-vaccine failures are more common than was more previously thought, particularly among individuals vaccinated in early life, long ago, and among re-vaccinees. Waning immunity – even among individuals vaccinated after 15 months of age, without the boosting effect of natural infections should be considered a relevant possibility in future planning of vaccination against measles.

ajcire, That type of information may be imperative as choice is being threatened in multiple states (or lost already) in the case where you might want to try to get a medical exemption for vaccination. History of advese events and immune function testing results are going to be valuable for those who have it. The problem is going to be over coming the attitude that any immune dysfunction is going make it all the more reason that your child should be vaccinated with anything/everything that they can create a response to, no matter how unnatual (or inflammatory) the response is. Personally, I'm of the opinion that constant manipulation of the infant immune system is wrecking havoc on at least some of our children. This is not to dismiss genetics or other environmental insults. I also have full respect for any one choosing a particular vaccine where they feel the reward out weighs the risk. Unfortunately, it seems parents are going to have to be the ones who convince the medical "authorities." http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20531967 Biologics. 2010 May 25;4:75-81. Hepatitis B virus and Homo sapiens proteome-wide analysis: A profusion of viral peptide overlaps in neuron-specific human proteins.

http://journals.plos...al.pone.0101257 Antibiotic Treatment Attenuates Behavioral and Neurochemical Changes Induced by Exposure of Rats to Group A Streptococcal Antigen I don't want to take away the initial discussion on this thread, but I thought this was important enough to leave here for anyone who reads the full study in reference to the strain (18) that was used http://www.phschool.com/science/science_news/articles/all_worlds_phage.html All the World's a Phage Viruses that eat bacteria abound—and surprise excerpts

Just posted on another thread, but may as well leave it here too. Important to read the entire study. There is some really interesting stuff there (how the rats were made susceptible to GAS antigen) what happen to serum IgG level etc. http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0101257 Antibiotic Treatment Attenuates Behavioral and Neurochemical Changes Induced by Exposure of Rats to Group A Streptococcal Antigen I'm only reading for the first time in bits and pieces, myself

pr40 That is the same article we have been just discussing on another thread (fecal transplant). I'm sure this has been posted on this forum before, but can't hurt to leave it again http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0101257 Antibiotic Treatment Attenuates Behavioral and Neurochemical Changes Induced by Exposure of Rats to Group A Streptococcal Antigen People who are using the search feature may be more likey to find under your heading

If anyone read the Offit et al paper, did you find it strange that he mentions one small study from Germany (496 children) regarding fewer infections in the vaccinated vs unvaccinated group? That paper is dated 2002, maybe there is something more recent, but for a country with the highest vaccination recommendations, don't you think we would have numerous studies like that?

from Jan's link http://www.microbeco...icle/view/26382 and The CDC is paralysed The phrase "where's the outrage," was circulating not long ago. It pops into my head often.

fuelforall, I found this last nite from a PM buddy that shared it a while ago. This seemed like a good place to leave it. http://www.nleducati...many-disorders/ Quote Lactobacillus rhamnosus may be able to prevent strep throat. A fascinating 2009 study from Italy found that the invasive capacity of eight strains of group A Streptococci (GAS)—all resistant to Erythromycin—was significantly inhibited by LGG, both live and heat-killed. The researchers studied human respiratory cells and concluded that the probiotic might be able to prevent strep throat infections. It has also cleared nasal passages in guinea pigs with allergic rhinitis. Lactobacillus rhamnosus reduces arthritis— perhaps because allergic disorders involve perturbed skin and gut mucosa and dysregulation of the immune response, according to researchers at Finland’s University of Turku. In a 2008 report they show that elimination diets and environmental changes are not effective enough in allergy, and perhaps establishing a healthy gut microbiota is equally important. This Lactobacillus strain, taken orally, along with other probiotics, actually reduces the amount of Staphylococcus aureus and beta-hemolytic streptococci in the nasal passages of humans. Yet the probiotics themselves do not colonise the nose. That suggests that LGG truly does have a body-wide immune-boosting effect. Another one Child with autism improves with antibiotic; prompts new investigations into autism http://medicalxpress.com/news/2015-03-child-autism-antibiotic-prompts.html

the talk about trace amts. of thimerosal and aluminum adjuvants may be of interest to parents who are deciding on a particular vaccine. In some cases you can substitute one vaccine for another if you are trying to avoid a particular element. I hadn't given any real thought to "trace amts." listed in some of these. Haley made me rethink that aspect. Haley vs. Offit: A Virtual Debate About Vaccines, The Greatest Medical Controversy of Our Time Robert Kennedy testifies Illinois state senate hearing http://traceamounts.com/illinois-state-senate-hearing-featuring-robert-f-kennedy-jr-complete-video/ TIP: Start this video at 15:40 Healthy 2020 with Dr Sherri Tenpenny for #b1less NEWS #CDCwhistleblower

I will be adding to this post. This is some initial information. I have wondered about this, as Teresa Conrick does in the AoA article. Congugated HIB 1990 recommended for 2 4 6 and 18 months (there was a hib vaccine prior to this one more near end) Hep B 1991 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9464208 PANDAS 1998....first studies of PANDAS kids http://www.ageofautism.com/2014/10/my-country-tis-of-pandas-and-pans.html My Country Tis of PANDAS and PANS and Now if you read what Offit has to say, he is one happy camper if you can engage TH cells (hence memory B cells) in an infant which normally will not happen at the young age that these are given. HIB is particularly interesting in my mind because it is a bacteia not a virus (it was misnamed and never corrected). The early vaccine was a pure polysaccharide vaccine and it didn't work, just like the " polysaccharide only," s pneumonia that was given to adults wouldn't work in infants, hence PCV formulas (Pneumococcal Conjugate Vaccine). (he leaves out the mention of aluminum when describing formulations) https://www2.aap.org/immunization/families/overwhelm.pdf more on history of HIB vaccine http://www.nvic.org/vaccines-and-diseases/HIB/history-hib-vaccine.aspx

I literally have tears running down my face. Mayzoo's post cracked me right up ...then powpow it is kinda pretty-- did you notice the other views, where they show it on the wall with furniture around (priceless) Now those are some people that I would like to party with. Good conversation there! Mazoo I've been dying for a giant lymphocyte decal. Could you keep an eye out? I'm thinking the 2nd one down on the right. Would look great over the fireplace http://www.fotosearch.com/photos-images/lymphocyte.html

Just thought I would mention that I ran across something that talked about histamine being released to soften gums when kids were teething. That was some thing that I wouldn't have thought of as contributing. My kids are the allergic type. Histamine flare was the only time I saw what PANS/PANDAS parents describe as abrupt onset or a totally changed child.

trintiybella, So glad things sound like they're calming down. Did you taste it, do you think it could cause lingering irritation? It's so scarey when something like that happens. It's been a long time, but those memories don't fade. Diges tive enzymes gave me a fright at one time.

I know you said no Prevnar, but did you have any testing regarding ability to respond to Polysaccharides? I'm sure you know this, but I mean the S pneumonia titers?

mayzoo I know this is probably being overly simplistic, but is it generally thought that your child has hyper adaptive response and hypo innate?

mayzoo and dasu, Are you saying that your kids didn't have the birth dose or didn't have the series at all? The newer combo shots are enough to make your head spin. more links.... http://www.vaccines.net/vaccine-induced-immune-overload.pdf Review of Vaccine Induced Immune Overload and the Resulting Epidemics of Type 1 Diabetes and Metabolic Syndrome, Emphasis on Explaining the Recent Accelerations in the Risk of Prediabetes and other Immune Mediated Diseases http://www.vaccines.net/toppage1.htm Congress Told Hepatitis B Vaccine Linked to Rise in Diabetes http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/cdc-data-supports-causal-relationship-between-vaccines-and-diabetes-diabetics-begin-seeking-legal-counsel-before-their-right-to-compensation-expires-vaccines-proven-to-be-largest-cause-of-insulin-dependent-diabetes-in-children-73348077.html CDC Data Supports Causal Relationship between Vaccines and Diabetes; Diabetics Begin Seeking Legal Counsel Before Their Right to Compensation Expires; Vaccines Proven to be Largest Cause of Insulin Dependent Diabetes in Children http://www.overcomingmultiplesclerosis.org/News-And-Events/Our-News/Detail/New+study+strongly+suggests+hepatitis+B+vaccination+in+France+sparked+a+wave+of+new+cases+of+MS/ New study strongly suggests hepatitis B vaccination in France sparked a wave of new cases of MS http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4266455/ Evolution of multiple sclerosis in France since the beginning of hepatitis B vaccination http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22235045/ Lupus. 2012 Feb;21(2):146-52. doi: 10.1177/0961203311429318. Autoimmunity following hepatitis B vaccine as part of the spectrum of 'Autoimmune (Auto-inflammatory) Syndrome induced by Adjuvants' (ASIA): analysis of 93 cases. http://vaccineimpact.com/2014/study-adjuvants-in-hepatitis-b-vaccine-linked-to-chronic-fatigue-syndrome-and-fibromyalgia/ http://www.epatienthealthcare.com/2015/03/05/attacking-ourselves-top-doctors-reveal-vaccines-turn-our-immune-system-against-us/#.VPo9D-Gj_IB Attacking Ourselves: Top Doctors Reveal Vaccines Turn Our Immune System Against Us

Is she doing any better? This site says the burning should subside in about 10 minutes, but I don't know if that is when it has been diluted. https://www.jcrows.com/oregano.html

91,332!!! I hope it gets closer to 200,000. The way the signatures are coming in it should make 100,000 with no problem, but we need every signature we can get. Did anyone notice if you click on the open petitions tab, there is a petition for Lyme? open until March 28th

Watching what happens in Oregon link found on this page http://vaccineliberationarmy.com/2015/02/26/wow-oregon-senator-sponsoring-ending-vaccine-exemption-crushes-herself/ http://www.globalresearch.ca/vaccines-linked-to-autism-preserve-medical-freedom-dr-paul-thomas-m-d/5433505

This is something that I always thought was interesting http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/releases/141710.php Shedding Light On Heart's 'Fight Or Flight' Response To Stress Even for those without a heart condition, it's a peculiar feeling when your heart "races" in response to stress. That pacing change happens in part because of how the enzyme calcium/calmodulin-dependent protein kinase II (CaM kinase II) is called into action by the body's 'fight or flight' stress response, University of Iowa researchers have found. opps that wasn't the one I was thinking of. I think this is it http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/05/080501125455.htm Heart Disease Discovery: New Mechanism Links Activation Of Key Heart Enzyme And Oxidative Stressmore on this thread http://latitudes.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=23457

Tracy, What I was really thinking was that your Dr. may have ordered it suspecting that it would be low and would strengthen your position for insurance. It sounds like there was another reason tho. I know Dr.s have a way of ordering tests with specific ideas in mind sometimes on how to get insuance coverage and I didn't want you to think that it was another indicator of an immune system problem if that wasn't really the case. eidt to add....since you mentioned HIV, I wondered if your son was tested for CD4 and it was found to be low? I only ask because I had ran across this article at some point and saved it beacuse I thought it was some easy reading on immune stuff. http://www.virusmyth.com/aids/hiv/milowcd4.htm excerpt

Tracy, I know that you are trying to get approval so this may be something that you don't really want to question, but I would want to know this if it were my child. It looks to me like the negative Hep B might not be a good indicator of immune function unless your Dr. did a challenge vax? Did your son get the series during infancy? http://www.cdc.gov/hepatitis/HBV/HBVfaq.htm#D11 How long does protection from Hepatitis B vaccine last? Studies indicate that immunologic memory remains intact for at least 20 years among healthy vaccinated individuals who initiated Hepatitis B vaccination >6 months of age. The vaccine confers long-term protection against clinical illness and chronic Hepatitis B virus infection. Cellular immunity appears to persist even though antibody levels might become low or decline below detectable levels. and Are booster doses of Hepatitis B vaccine recommended?Booster doses of Hepatitis B vaccine are recommended only in certain circumstances: For hemodialysis patients, the need for booster doses should be assessed by annual testing for antibody to Hepatitis B surface antigen (anti-HBs). A booster dose should be administered when anti-HBs levels decline to <10 mIU/mL. For other immunocompromised persons (e.g., HIV-infected persons, hematopoietic stem-cell transplant recipients, and persons receiving chemotherapy), the need for booster doses has not been determined. When anti-HBs levels decline to <10 mIU/mL, annual anti-HBs testing and booster doses should be considered for those with an ongoing risk for exposure. So <10 mlU/mL? Then this study. Only 24% prior to challenge http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24843060 RESULTS:At baseline, 24% had protective anti-HBs levels of ≥10 IU/mL; 92% achieved protective levels after challenge dose. Although group 1 had a lower proportion of seroprotection at baseline, group and challenge dosage were not associated with postchallenge proportion of seroprotection. Being in group 2, higher test dosage, higher baseline geometric mean titer, and nonwhite race were associated with significantly higher geometric mean titer after challenge dose. CONCLUSIONS:More than 90% of study participants immunized against HB as infants exhibited a seroprotective response to a challenge dose of vaccine. Duration of protection from the primary infant HB vaccine series extended through the adolescent years in the setting of low HB endemicity. Here is something that gives a little more info on that study http://npin.cdc.gov/news/hepatitis-b-infant-immunization-protects-through-adolescent-years