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Hilarys notes from biochat:

You can access this file at the URL:



Michael Lang – Brainchild Nutritionals


Michael is also on Autism One Radio every other Sunday


Q: I have heard that TMG and possibly DMG can compete

with or block MB12. Do you have any insight into this

and/or have you had any personal experience using MB12

injections? Also, have you chelated your kids and for

how long?


A: I used DMG with my daughter in ‘96-98, sublingual.

MB-12 is a very good protocol to start with for

children with high mercury. All the research I’ve done

(1996 when I started researching autism), I knew my

kids had a detox impairment. We gave glutathione,

antioxidants, sulphation, gluterate, glycine, taurine,

methylation, acetylation. We gave sublingual DMG and

B-12. But after a while the B-12, DMG, folinic all

peaked, and it was clear to me that it was the sulfur

that was still helping. I gave them a sophisticated

blend of nutrients to support detox and redox. My

daughter had problems when NOT on the Feingold diet,

had a lot of trouble with phenols.


Q: Hi, my son reacts to vitamin A even in small

amounts. Do you know why? He gets irritable, and

slightly aggressive.


A: I don’t know exactly why, but here are some

possibilities. What kind of vitamin A? Pulmitate? Cod

liver oil? (answer: all, even RDA in multivitamin)

Make sure it’s a good form, not rancid (oxidized). Did

you see a similar reaction to vit C, vit E, or

glutathione? There’s a workable halflife in

antioxidants or glutathione, when they get into the

bloodstream that face oxidative stress. When they go

to do battle, there are 1000 enemy soldiers, and you

march in 20 to fight them. Such is the case with free

radicals and oxidative stress. There is a whole list

of processes impaired in autism, they rely on

recycling or redox, that is a very sulfur-dependant

process. When you put glutathione or another

antioxidant into this type of body with so many

impaired processes, they oxidize fairly rapidly,

you’ve just introduced more oxidative toxins. Perhaps

this is what’s happening in your case.

If you put oxidized glutathione into the body of

someone who already has 4-5 times the oxidative

burden, it’s not going to help. Look at that

predominance of oxidative stress turning antioxidants

to the dark side.


Q: I was reading about your new metal detox product

that comes in dropper form. Can you tell me more

about it and what have you been seeing from it?


A: Herbathione, developed 6 years ago. Combination

western, Chinese, Indian herbs, that all help

redox/recycling glutathione. Hepatic liver

glutathione, plasma glutathione, cerebral glutathione

was all increased by using these herbs. It’s almost

like homeopathic. It’s a concentrated tincture.

Another product that we resell is called NDF

(nanocolloidal detox factors). It’s nanosized

(extremely-small particle size) chlorella, a natural

mineral product.

I’m looking to make a mercuric reductase product,

found in certain algaes. These organisms convert

mercuric chloride (HgCl2) to an elemental form (Hg0).

These species adapted over millions of years to

detoxify water. There is a fish off Calcutta, India –

a bottom feeder – water passes through its gills and

this species of fish can resist mercury, it has a

mercury-resistant bacteria. So I’m looking at things

to help with redox, and detox of mercury. The folks at

BioRay might on the same path.


Q: Michael we are just refining the process 2 years

into BioMed 1 year into successful chelation what more

can we do to open sulfur pathways we are using Epsom

Salts baths and oral MSM? We have noticed more

language and clarity. I want to do all we can to

capitalize on this since it is producing good results

as we chelate. We also eat an organic diet GFCF dye

free/preservative free diet as well.


A: Those are all good things, organic, gfcf, etc. Wish

we could just open sulfur pathways. The severity of

autism is probably related to the compromise in sulfur

pathways. I used many forms of sulfur. We didn’t use

chelation or MB-12 shots back when I was recovering my

children. It was like an apothecary. Doing research on

phenolic foods, I found a close relationship with


If I overdosed on Tylenol, they’d use n-acetyl

cysteine. So I started using that, methionine, MSM,

glucosamine sulfate, condroitin sulfate, Epson salt

baths. I discovered a lot of those were detrimental.

On a high dose of sulfur, within a week my daughter

would be worse then before we even started the

process. The extra sulfur was causing a backup of some

toxic material her body couldn’t process. I started to

reduce. The methionine has to go through so many

conversions before it gets through. MSM, Epson salts

were both good, as well as food-based amounts (30 mg)

of NAC (n-acetyl cysteine). Too much was detrimental.

Too much NAC would go against methionine synthase. We

eat broccoli, or onions, or brussel spouts each day.

Once I cut back and found the right amount, she did


300-500 mg a day of MSM is about right. If you notice

flatulence, cramping, bloating, you need to cut back

25%. Epson salts very good – I’ll take a half of the ½

gallon carton, and let them soak for a good hour. NAC

in small amounts. Glucosamine sulphate, biotin,

thiamine, molybdenum. Also enhance sulfur in the diet.

Make stews and soups, with onion in broth. Eggs are

also high in sulfur. Broaden the types of sulfur,

keeping the amounts moderate to low.


Q: Thank you for taking the time to answer our

questions. Have you considered making your vitamin

mixture in a pill form?


A: Yes, it’s been asked. The body digests things to

make them liquids, so the most effective way to get

things into the body is in liquid form. It is possible

to take this and put in a capsule, but difficult to

get the concentration right. A 50 lb child would have

to take 5-6 horse pills. I have friends that do

colonics professionally – this is gross – when they

look at the effluent from the colonics, they find

capsules/tablets still undigested. When you have a

dimishment of enzymes (like in autism) that would

normally break these capsules down, it will stand more

chance not to be broken down, so a liquid is better.

Also we don’t have the equipment, we’d have to farm

the process out. So those are all the reasons we

haven’t yet.


Q: there's been discussion that TD_DMPS - is not

"really" acting as a chelator, but rather, it's doing

something to open a sulfur pathway... what's your

opinion on that??


A: I agree. If you look at the formulary, there is

cysteine, glutathione ,methionine, etc. It’s 2/3 or ¾

sulfur, and the rest DMPS. So what is actually doing

the work? We’ve been doing sulfur interventions

(secretin, b6 magnesium, b12, etc) since the

biomedical started. Both DMPS and DMSA are pro-sulfur.

So I think that we’re using fairly weak chelators in

TD-DMPS that have a propensity for grabbing mercury.

You have a river that’s not flowing well, you supply

water to tributaries, and the river flows better. This

is kind of what you’re doing. Some side effects –

potential for liver damage, bad dysbiosis,

compromising immune function down to the level of bone

marrow. My whole premise has been that you need to go

low and slow. I’ve heard others say this too.

There is probably some genetic component to autism,

damage to the DNA that is passed on to successive

generations, weaken the progeny, make them more

susceptible to mercury.

You have to rethink how to detox, don’t rush the

process. It will take a couple of years.

Low and slow.


Q: Do you recommend oral (lipoceutical ) glutothione

or TD??? Is there a problem with mercury or other

heavy metals in the NDF Plus. I think I had heard it

may contain metals??? What results have you seen with

Herbathione? Thank You.


A: I have some misgivings about TD-glutathione,

because it has a chance of being preoxidized. The

lipoceutical glutathione is a better bet, you’re

surrounding it with a lipid to protect it from

oxidation. As far as mercury in NDF+, metal free,

pca-rx – these products are well-tested. We’ve been

getting asked this a lot lately. They’re using

cultured chlorella.

Herbathione is not being used to the degree I wish it

was. I have one child recovered with this amongst

other things. She was using Herbathione. She asked us

to make bigger bottles, the whole family is using it.

My daughter, that child, plus 2 others are recovered –

as long as there is redox support in their protocol.

This mom does fish oil, antioxidants at this point.

For my child Herbathione is a finishing step. If she

misses her vitamins, we fill in with this. She

regresses to asperger, HFA without having her redox

support. These kids will have lifelong impairments in

antioxidants, glutathione. Mercury most likely causes

this damage.


Q: Thanks for your awesome products. (We use III and

megamins). Anyway, my son has started smelling like

sulfur lately. He takes lipoGSH and TD-GSH, but this

is a recent occurrence. When he sweats, he just reeks

of sulfur. Is this a sign of GSH overdosing? A good

thing? (He's doing great, behaviorally!) Also, are

you adding ALA back into your vitamin III formula? I

think my son did much better with that. I'm

considering using TD-ALA until you guys (hopefully!)

add it back in.


A: If sweating sulfur, then you might want to ratchet

down the lipo and Td glutathione. Find a better level.

If sulfur in the stool, most commonly it’s and

allergen reaction from yeast or fungal overgrowth.

Adding ALA back – we’ve tried 3 different forms of

lipoic acid. We used alpha-lipoic (R and S

mix/counterparts). R is natural, S is synthetic. The

concern was that with the synthetic form, it might

block it’s natural counterpart. Then we used the

single R alpha-lipoic, but when mixed with water it

turns to a mix like playdough and crazy glue! It will

stick to the gut, intestine. It was also very

expensive. Then we used a liquid lipoic, wasn’t

suitable for our multi. So I’m as frustrated as you,

but for now we won’t be adding it back.


Q: What supplements do you recommend for improving the

sulfur pathway/redox recycling, sorry, late, if you

already answered this.


A: Start with small levels. 30 mg NAC, 300-500 mg MSM,

Epson salt bath, glucosamine sulfate, condroitin

sulfate, biotin, thiamine, molybdenum. Cruciferous

vegetables, beef and chicken, broccoli and brussel

sprouts, asparagus, cabbage. Durian fruit (sp?) –

looks like alien seed pod, like a custard texture

inside, smells sulfury. We’ve tried that a little.

B1,B2,B3,B6,B12, A, C, E, selenium, zinc, lipoic acid,

glycine, will all help with glutathione formation and

glutathione recycling. If you go to Autism One

website, my presentation Beyond Methylation is there.

Powerpoint. Shows variety of nutrients and what they

do in the body.


Q: Where do you recommend new parents begin with all

of the above information? Feeling a little

overwhelmed. We are GFCF and non-verbal. We also just

had our 5 yr physical and skipped our vaccinations for

the first time.


A: Good on skipping the vaccinations. A good start

online to do research is PubMed. You can type in

glutathione and antioxidants, for example. ABMD, CK2

are good yahoo groups. I didn’t do a lot of biomed

work with doctors, I went on my own, that was my

choice. Not everyone does things this way. I did do

some testing. But mostly I researched, and observed

what my children were presenting. And take care of

yourself. This is a hard thing to go through. Keep

your hope and optimism.


Q: My son (50 lbs) has been on level 2 of your vitamin

mineral and he has seemed very stimmy. There are

other variables in his regimen, but I did cut back to

1 teaspoon TID (from 2 t.) It seems to be tolerated a

bit better. (admittedly, I worked him up quickly to

the 2 t. TID). Do you have kids who don't reach

their "optimal dose"? Should I try to work him back

up? Or is it better to switch to PAK or level one at

full dose (2t. TID)? Thank you for your response.


A: Whenever you see stimmy behavior, this is probably

B6 in excess. Only use as much as is necessary to do

the job. B6 also will inhibit some sulfur processes.

If this is a new supplementation protocol, he might be

better on the PAK formula. If he has been on this

formula for a while, and the stimminess is new, you

can probably do fine with less B6


Q: What’s the name of the fruit?


A: Durian, you can get it at some Asian markets, it’s

very expensive, cheaper to buy frozen.


Q: Were your children GFCF and are they off the diet

now? Also, why are many of these children not able

to tolerate folinic acid but can tolerate FolaPro.


A: My children are still gfcf. When my daughter was

3.5 we were just on Feingold, it brought about

profound changes for her. My son had allergy symptoms.

I do think he has an immune problem. Wheat and dairy

are also phenolic.

I don’t recall the structure of Folapro, I think it’s

calcium folinate? We use calcium folinate in our

product. (Folapro is l-5 methyl tetrahydrofolate.)

I don’t use a lot of folic acid with my kids. I’m

hearing from folks doing mb-12 shots that the folinic

is very helpful at first and its effects diminish over


I would love to add methyl B-12 to our formula, have

wanted to for a long time. It’s very expensive, and

MB12 is not real stable in water, unfortunately.

Q: Do some kids have an intolerance to sulfur? If so,

what can we do to get them to tolerate it? Also, you

said that sometimes a body under great oxidative

stress can react badly to antioxidants. What should a

parent do if this is the case?


A: Most children would not have a broad intolerance,

but there might be certain forms of sulfur that they

react to, or certain levels they react to. Keep a log

book – what level, what form, what manufacturer, what

was it combined with, etc. Low doses will be better

tolerated. The forms that have to undergo less

biotransformation, fewer pathways will be better

tolerated. That sort of bumps methionine out.

Look at sulfur-bearing foods if the supplements aren’t

working, also the Epson salt baths.

I’d do tests to find out more about the oxidative

stress issue. What are the levels of toxins in the

body of the child that cause them to react this way,

react to all the things that should be helping them.

What is the mercury burden, what other toxins; how is

the gut?


Q: On your A1 pres. you mention DNA repair. Does

micro algae, NDF+ do this, cat's claw?Is this done

earlier or later in the recovery process?


A: I don’t know about the cat’s claw, and whether it

helps DNA repair.

We need to understand the breaks/mutations in DNA, and

look at how to patch the DNA. There are some emerging

theories of DNA repair. I am finding that algae that

has survived with mercury, volcanoes, etc have the

ability to detoxify mercury. They have a unique

construct of iron-sulfur clusters. Like a circular

revolving door. The electrons that want to get in or

out have to pass through this revolving door. When you

put mercury, pesticide, barbiturates, pharmaceuticals

in the body, it can inhibit this process. When you

cannot transfer electrons back and forth, you have

impaired redox and detox.

Even though I know my daughter is really healthy,

healthier then I am, (I don’t see any evidence of

mercury toxicity), I still see when she goes off her

supplements, she has slight regression. Fixing the DNA

would be the holy grail.

The micro algae is able to repair DNA in algae using

the iron-sulfur clusters.

Can we fix the DNA? I don’t know yet. I have to

visualize a biochemical target. My premise is that if

we can do DNA repair, we might have a child able to go

off antioxidants and other supplements.




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You are an angel. :D)))))))))))))))))


This is wonderful wonderful thing for you to pull together. Please do tell Hilary that she is helping a whole group she didn't even know about.


I haven't been around the forum at all lately--life and work are all-consuming now, and have only started to make a dent in reading this thread. Though I will say that summer with 'no homework' is a needed break for our family.


I am also still blown away that you found that directlabs.com site to order your own tests. I am amazed that my friends aren't taking advantage of it--I tell them about it. I personally have just done a little there (doctors data hair test), since our DAN doctor has been so good about ordering whatever tests we want, so it is less necessary for me.


I got all my amalgams out, and will start MT (metallothionine)promotion for myself soon via Pfeiffer. I have the supplements on hand--just figuring out if I need my crowns removed first also, since MT promotion is supposed to pull metals, and old crowns can have mercury/amalgams under them. I see that Dr. Usman (ex Pfeiffer) mentions metallothionine also.


Caz, glad things are okay, I am sorry for the setback with the virus, but you know that is temporary! Good luck with B-12, we do sublingual B-12 ourselves.


Again Kim, this is a very amazing thing for you to have uncovered this resource and shared it. As for blood tests with things in common--you know I believe they exist, they just aren't the ones the mainstream doctor's typically run. More like cancer and immune system specialists (and of course the autism community).


I am still personally playing with the concept of whether metals redistribute or not if the gut isn't healthy. Andy Cutler on yahoo is convinced they don't IF you do a DMSA every 3 hours vs 8 hours--otherwise he believes that they do redistribute. Just one more opinion that I am throwing out there, not intended to be stated as fact at all. I don't believe anyone has proof on this one either way. I sure wish this one was known for sure.


A friend of mine says that Donna Gates (bodyecology) says that healing the gut will pull out the mercury on its own. Man, what a lot of opinions on this one. I suspect that as with everything else here, one size doesn't fit all. But Donna wants to have you eat lots of fermented foods (e.g. fermented coconut water)--tough for kids--very sour.


Good luck to everyone.


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What a wonderful surprise to see a post from you! I have to say that the reason this thread is here is because of you. You were the one who directed me to the Autism Enzyme board, and there is such amazing info. there and at asd_solutions. Karen DeFlyce has been an awesome resource too.


I have to refrain from calling you "Our Dearly Departed" Claire. There are many many times, I have wanted to refer to information that you have shared.


I was actually searching this forum for an old thread that you started on "testing" this morning.


The metal redistributing, and how much improvement can be had with gut healing alone, are two of the many question I have also. On metals, from what I have listened to on biochat, the general impression I am left with is, it may not be as likely as some have thought, but as you pointed out, no one is certain, just theories.


A couple of us have started using Houstons Digestive Enzymes. I think part of the reason we don't say "Wow" more often is because you are never sure exactly what is making the improvements. Again, this option was something you brought to my attention.


I would love to ask you a million questions, but I am well aware of the sacrifice your family and work suffer when too much time is spent on the computer. I get so side tracked, that I don't accomplish what I got on for, quite often. I hope in the fall when things slow down a bit, you might have a little more time.


I remember you were working toward MT Promotion for your son shortly before you quit posting, when his zinc/copper got out of line? Now, you are working toward it too. I am hoping that means you had good results with your son. I know Carolyn recently had her amalgams removed also.


Again, it was wonderful to hear from you. You take care, and get back with us when you can!



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I had missed this one...


Wednesday July 27, 9:00pm EST

Alan Israel from Lee Silsby

Alan Israel, R.Ph. is the owner of Lee Silsby Compounding Pharmacy.

He graduated from Ohio Northern University College of Pharmacy in

1976. Alan works tirelessly to meet the diverse needs of his patients

and to insure that they have the best chance to receive positive

treatment outcomes. He is a member of The International Academy of

Compounding Pharmacists and the Professional Compounding Centers of

America (PCCA). Alan also has had an article published in The

International Journal of Pharmaceutical Compounding, the premier

educational publication for compounding pharmacists worldwide.


Alan Israel from Lee Silsby Compounding Pharmacy

Lee Silsby specializes in compounding for Autism.



(TD = transdermal)


Q: What is your opinion of custom amino acids? Do you think they

help with increasing glutathione in the body? We also use

transdermal gluthithione and we think it helps? Also, we are using

your td dmsa for 2 rounds, should we be seeing anything yet in terms

of improvement? We are concerned with the strength being weak, or

rubbing off.


A: Amino acids are very important. We're always working on new

formulas. We have a vitamin mineral formula that is GF/CF, and SCD,

developed by Dr Baker, Dr Lonsdale, and the pharmacy. Lee Silsby has

a study on their website on their TD-glutathione versus other

companies' glutathione.


Q: My son is about to start td-dmsa from you. What

minerals/supplements should I be sure that he is taking? I have

heard something about taking zinc, but I do not know how much or how

often. Anything else?


A: Your DAN! dr will steer you in the right direction. Additional

supplements to the TD-DMSA – you need more vitamins and minerals.

Zinc should be 30 mg, that's already in the Lee Silsby formula

(vitamin/mineral formula).


Q: Do most docs recommend continuing minerals on the ON days of TD-

DMSA? Does DMSA have much affinity for beneficial minerals? Is it

OK to keep your formulation of glutathione and TD-DMSA in the



A: At the last DAN! conference, some drs said they go right through

chelation with vitamins and minerals, in other words not just on OFF

days not just on ON days. Store the TD-DMSA at room temperature. If

you do refrigerate, put it on the door wrapped in a towel, not at

the back of the fridge where it's really cold.


Q: Do you have the transdermal EDTA at your pharmacy?


A: A DAN! dr has asked for that, so yes we do have one. We looked at

stability and penetration, and we feel this is the best, most stable

formula available.


Q: How much regression are you seeing with your TD DMSA?


A: We only see regression if the dose is too high, so we caution

DAN! doctors with their protocol. When they back off and lengthen

time in between the regression does not appear at all.


Q: how important is it to use gloves while rubbing on td glutathione

or td dmsa? my son hates me wearing gloves!!!


A: It's important, esp if you have mercury fillings. The glutathione

is ok to get on you, but not the dmsa. You can use a glass bottle to

rub on the gel.


Q: What, to your knowledge, is the efficacy of TD-DMSA vs. oral in

removing mercury? How much of the oral dose is actually "absorbed"?


A: There is very little literature; Dr Bradstreet did most of the

DMSA research. The TD-DMSA is much more effective then oral DMSA.

When we first started working on TD-DMSA, we discussed with Dr Bock

and Dr Lonsdale, and decided to go with ½ the usual dosage of oral

DMSA. Even so, with the ability to penetrate, it's so much more

effective. There are side effects (like yeast beast) with oral that

you don't get with Transdermal.


(Alan put his son on to speak, Adam, he's 30 years old. He's been

chelated with DMSA. He is not on the spectrum, but had some things

that kids on the spectrum do have)


Q: Where is the best place on the body to apply TD GSH (transdermal

glutathione)? How long does it take to absorb into the skin? Also,

how long is TD GSH good for? Can you get a couple of months at a

time when you fill the prescription?


A: It takes 30 seconds to absorb most of it, but leave on 30 minutes

at least. Apply to top of shins, top of thighs, elbows, etc, any

thick skinned areas. Our version is 100% stable, you can order 3

months at a time. Other formulas tested lose 80% effectiveness after

90 days.


Q: I have Melatonin which is hypoallergenic casein and gluten free -

is this also scd legal? the ingredients are plant cellulose and

magnesium stearate.



A: Those ingredients are SCD legal.


Q: I've looked at the ingredients in your ASD Vitamin/Mineral

Powder. I'm interested in trying it but my son's current doses are

higher than what it offers. How would you suggest getting the rest

of the supplements into him. Prescribed compounding? He won't

swallow pills, capsules, etc. We look for liquids.


A: We could make a secondary formula for you to get you the levels

you need. Work with your DAN! dr to get this. We can make them gf/cf

and/or SCD.


Q: What's the best test for checking metal excretion on TD-DMSA--is

fecal OK for a kid who is not potty trained? When to collect the

sample during the 3 day round?


A: From my experience, patients have done 3x a day for 3 days, then

11 days off. They do the fecal test right before starting the

next "round". We've seen much more metals in fecal then urine with

our TD-DMSA. Some states (NY) do not allow fecal tests, but you can

go out of state for that.


Q: Is it important to be taking glutathione while chelating?

Although I am about to start td-dmsa it is not in my son's



A: We're hoping by the next DAN! conf one of the drs who works with

us will have a spreadsheet from her patients. It is important to use

glutathione, in our eyes, while chelating. TD-DMSA, TD-glutathione,

and a good vitamin/mineral.

Some of the drs use IV glutathione, but I don't have firsthand

experience with that.


Q: My son is clearly a gut child and we only did one trial of dmps

oral and he stimmed and became more autistic than i care to

remember...I have been told by many parents that my son will

probably test positive for metals and was wondering i would love not

to put more pressure on his gut. And what role does glutathione play

in a child's recovery i am fairly new to biomed and dan.


A: Look at autismreasearchinstitute.com, there is a DAN! treatment

protocol. Glutathione is important.


Q: My daughter has done 2 rounds of TD-DMSA. She had a terrible

reaction to TD-DMPS but is doing great (so far) with TD-DMSA. Just

wanted to share with those who may have had a bad reaction to DMPS.

Thanks Alan for talking to me before we started!


A: There are about 350 children right now using the TD-DMSA.


Q: Do you or could you compound vitamin C into a high-dose TD

formula? If so, is this absorbed effectively? Also, what other

vitamins and minerals do you make in a TD form?


A: There are a lot of stability issues with transdermal vitamins,

esp vitamin C. You should be careful, to get C transdermally might

not be the best thing.


Q: We started with oral DMSA, had the yeast problem. Switch to TD-

DMPS, which we're happy with. Can you give us a crash course on

which chelators have an affinity for which metals?


A: Some drs say DMPS pulls mercury better, but we see that our TD-

DMSA pulls mercury better. We're seeing variations of folks

combining EDTA with DMPS or DMSA. Hopefully the DAN! drs will share

what they're seeing at the next DAN! conference.


Q: My 4 year old son is receiving IV push DMPS followed by push of

sanuvis. He is seeing a DAN doctor in CA. How important is the

diet during detox. What is the lesser evil....wheat or sugar?


A: Diet is very important during detox, gut issues can occur. You

should watch wheat and sugar, gf/cf is a good way to go.


Q: Does TD DMSA pull less minerals than TD DMPS??? Thank You.


A: We don't have that data.


Q: I have been reading on many post that Nystatin has preservatives

in it is this true?


A: Nystatin off the shelf is about 50% sugar, with preservatives. We

compound it gf/cf and sugar free with no preservatives.


Q: Is giving Glutathione via a nebulizer effective? In conjunction

with transdermal?


A: There are folks doing both. I work with Dr Nancy O'Hara. We are

reviewing it to see how valuable it is. In some patients she's

seeing good, in others she's seeing no changes. It remains to be



Q: Alan, can you speak about the dosage of TD DMSA and how often one

should test? Many people are wondering how long they will have to



A: The dosage is 5mg per kilo. My son pulled all his mercury after

90 days, still has nickel. Many drs test after 60 days, each dr

makes his/her own decision on when to test, but typically 60 days.


Q: Are you dispensing much TTFD any more? Is yours a two part cream

like the gsh?


A: Ours is soy-free, yes we still dispense. Since authia came on

market, we dispense less TTFD. The odor of our compounded version is

less strong.


Q: Does TD-DMSA have glutathione in it as well or should we get

Transdermal glutathione separately? How many times a day do we apply

td-glutathione? Does it help to apply it even on the td-dmsa-OFF



A: Twice a day. Some practitioners increase to 3 times a day during

chelation, and they notice the child is not as tired.


Q: This question is regarding my NT kid who has lost complete self

control after his flu shot this year and I give him Epson salt baths

but the change has not reversed. He has gone from Student of the

month to in the principles office at 6 years of age. Would he be a

good candidate from td dmps or td dmsa?


A: It's a cause for concern. Talk to your DAN! practitioner.


Q: My question is what is the opinion of the speakers on IV push

DMPS followed by a push of sanuvis? Do they feel it is safe and is

it a quicker chelating process?


A: I'm not familiar with sanuvis, and don't have DMPS experience.


Q: Do you make a pleasant tasting herbal anitbacterial formulation

for bacterial overgrowth in the gut ?


A: There are many things on the market like biocidin, so we haven't

compounded anything.


Q: Any side effects while using TTFD?


A: (this is Adam answering) I didn't notice any, except on the first

night of using the formulation I was overheated. That seems to

happen to me every time I start a chelator. I wake at 1:30 AM

overheated. Other then that, no side effects.

I'm done chelating now. My wife and I are about to have a baby, and

she and I are both mercury free. The first several rounds make me

tired, run down. By the end, there were no noticeable effects from

it. So as the metals are pulled out, it becomes less different. The

3/11 schedule is better then the 3 on 4 off, because I really needed

the 11 days rest.












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GREAT to see a post from you Claire :D


Kim, i echo that appreciation for the excellent job you are doing with this very informative thread.... sure wish this depth of knowledge had been available when we started floundering around 5 years ago....but am just so thankful that there is finally a very valuable opening up of real and natural understanding of all these underlying mechanisms and natural ways to try to remedy things

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  • 3 weeks later...



I am simply transferring information. You are the one who did the tough work going it alone to help your son as you did, and hanging around to help so many and giving so much of yourself. I don't know if you will ever really know how many you have helped.


Sorry, I didn't post when this biochat was to take place. The 16th seemed a long way off, a few weeks ago.





Mary Romaniec

GFCF in 10 EASY weeks.

A Streets-Smart Approach to Negotiating your Child's IEP.

Her experiences with IVIG.

Recently she completed an article on relationship challenges.





Her son is recovered from autism (article in Mothering magazine a

year ago).




Q: My daughter is starting IVIG next week. She has very high ASO

titers. How did you determine that you needed IVIG for your son,

and what benefits did you see?


A: My son went to see Dr Gupta. My son's immune system was

suppressed. But because my son's immune system was not suppressed

enough, insurance would not pay. We went ahead and did the IVIG.

Without this my son would not be recovered. We're so happy we did it.


Q: How long did this take to recover?


A: Saw progress after the first infusion. We saw jumps for 19 months

that we did this. All major jumps. After a few months went from non-

verbal to verbal. When he plateaued we stopped. It is expensive.

My son was recovered by age 4.


Q: can you please explain what IVIG is?


A: IV immunoglobin – human blood. Comes from thousands of donors.

You're taking antibodies from donors. It helps with autoimmune



Q: How long, and what did you see?


A: We did the treatment (IVIG) for 19 months. We saw significant

improvements every month. The school district saw remarkable

changes. They'd never seen anything like this before. We were

witnessing miracle events every day.


Q: What is the test to determine if your child qualifies?


A: There are a series of tests to be done by an immunologist. Dr

Gupta is at UC Irvine in California. He did tests to tell where the

immune system was struggling. He also did an antibody titer. My son

was missing the antibody titer to polio even though he had the



Q: Is it blood?


A: yes. We asked about the blood resources. We were comfortable


Q: Do you know if IVIG works as well for kids that are older? My

son is now 11.


A: It does work, at what age I don't know. The best way to determine

if appropriate, do the tests, find out if his immune system is

severely suppressed. If it is, that's actually good news, because

insurance might cover. For a child that age, could be



Q: can you talk about types of carnitine vs carnitor?


A: sorry, I'm not familiar


Q: you consider your son cured from ivig, not diet?


A: Actually, he's recovered, not cured. I'm always looking out to

make sure he stays well. Without gf/cf we don't think IVIG would

have worked as well. We're still on the diet. For us, all 3 things

worked together, gf/cf, IVIG and behavior therapy. My son is very

well trained to keep himself on the diet. Daniel is 6 years old now.


Q: Is IVIG considered a "mainstream" therapy for immune

suppression? In my wonderful home state of FL insurance companies

are exempted from anything considered experimental-never mind for



A: yes, for immune suppression, this is the treatment. FL is one of

those interesting states. If you have a physician ordering IVIG,

they will be looked at closely. Dr Bradstreet and Kartzinel got

nailed on that.

Insurance would need to see immune-suppression, or something other

then autism.

Dr Bradstreet is a fan of IVIG…but now has to use it as a last

resort. He has to show due diligence now.


Q: We will be going thru the IEP process for the first time for my

almost 3 yo son for preschool in the next couple of weeks... any



A: Yes, lots. There is a great book The Complete IEP Guide by Lauren


www.tacanow.com has an IEP checklist that I wrote. I also wrote an

article on this.

Go in prepared, bring a tape recorder, notify them in writing about



Q: What is your view on soy products?


A: Soy can cause erosion of the esophagus and large intestine. Many

of our kids get OD'ed on soy because we put them on gf/cf. But it's

a very common allergen. My son had to have an endoscopy because I

OD'ed him on soy. Please use it very rarely, or not at all if you're

child has a sensitivity.

It's very common to have IgG allergy to soy, more common then not.


Q: what do you think of electrodermal screening?


A: Sorry, don't know about this


Q: You are GFCF, what are your thoughts on SCD?


A: I'm a big fan. I encourage folks to start with gf/cf though, it's

easier to start with. The SCD has casein, and I think casein removal

is important. (Rick N adds that casein is bad for MB12, interferes

with methionine synthase pathway)


Q: My daughter tested negative on hep B titers and tetanus titers.

Did you mention that your son was negative for polio?


A: If your daughter was immune suppressed on two or more tests,

insurance will cover IVIG.


Q: are you familiar with kefir and if so what are you thoughts on

this as far as casein and - do you have experience with non-dairy



A: I haven't heard of a non-dairy kefir, and I'm not a fan of

casein. A little bit is not a good idea for our kiddos. If you need

probiotics, rather then kefir go to acidophilus.


Q: there is young green coconut kefir from body ecology diet


A: I'm a fan of Body Ecology Diet. You have to determine if it's

right for your particular child.


Q: How can you determine if your child is having an intolerance to a

food if your child's behavior is typically erratic anyway? My DAN

doc wants me to remove soy/egg and reintroduce it to see if there is

any rxn...



A: Did your DAN dr not run an IgG? He should run a full IgG. This

is the best way to find what your child is sensitive to. We had to

remove 21 allergens for my son.


Q: Can you recommend a bread mix that taste like "real" bread. We

tried several (this was a couple of years ago) and they just tasted

weird. If you know of something that will make good pancakes and

biscuits that would be great.


A: favorite bag mixes causeyourespecial.com




Q: 2 questions - We are starting the 3rd year of preschool and I've

requested a full day program because he is progressing nicely. This

will be a battle with our school which things "progressing means

less is needed." So I'm trying to figure out if I should be

satisfied with a full a.m. program and a unstructured p.m. play



A: If he hasn't achieved the goal, you don't dial back services. You

as the parent need to lead the charge, and get the school to follow.

We got a shadowed aide in a private preschool, with 5 hours speech,

all paid for by the school district. I clearly demonstrated that the

proposal for my son was not appropriate. I needed him to emulate

normal children by kindergarten.


Q: 2nd question - we are seeing better communication after b12

shots - but LOTS more frustration. HELP! It looks like terrible

two's but I don't know how to help him since his communication

skills progress so slowly!


If anyone wants the article, go to tacanow.com


Q: I'm really apprehensive to send my 3 year old to preschool

because we are strictly following GFCF diet. Wherever there are

young children, there are contra-band foods. I don't think an EA or

teachers assistant would be able to police my child's grabby

hands... any suggestions


A: If your child is grabby, you need to get a shadow aide. Meet with

the teacher at the beginning of school year, explain that a little

bit of gluten or casein will turn your child into a demon. Make sure

there is no regular playdough, the teacher should get gluten-free

playdough. I've never had a problem getting teachers on board.


Q: Can you take us through the 10 easy weeks to GFCF? It seems like

we cannot get started because we are afraid our son won't eat



A: The 10 week calendar is on the tacanow.com website.

Remove dairy for the first 2 weeks.

Go slow with the rest of the diet.

Stock up on ready to eat and package mixes at first.

Third week, breakfast.

Fourth week, tack on lunch.

Fifth week, dinner.

Etc. (see tacanow)

There are usually 5 foods a child will eat because of the opiod

high. When you remove these foods (gluten/casein), they'll over time

get used to eating other foods, the craving will go away after a

week or so.


Q: does anyone know how to get a shadow aide?


A: These are aides well-trained in autism, will not overwhelm the

child, but is there to help.


Q: what do you do for cheese?


A: Almost all of them have casein, there is only one brand (Chreese)

that is similar, but it has soy. We go without it.


Q: What is the thing(s) in the diet that most effects tantruming


A: There are a variety. Gluten and casein. Artificial colors,

preservatives, phenolics, sugars. Yeast overgrowth.


Q: What is it about french fries that kids-or at least my 8yo- go

nuts about? (McDonalds)


A: We use Cascadian farms and bake the fries.

McDonalds is fried in soy oil.

We eat McD's once in a while.


Q: What are some GFCF toothpastes you recommend? I live in Canada...


A: Toms of Maine non-fluoride, or Kirkmans non-fluoride




I want to tell you about another article I wrote. We all grieve at

different levels. The article is coming out, I'd be happy to forward

it when it comes out. In the meantime I'd like the share some tips

in getting through this Autism diagnosis.

You commiserate with friends, but there are various levels.

1) you're struck with fear, overwhelming, all-consuming. One or

both of the spouses get stuck in that mode.

2) You're angry. You can also get stuck here.

3) Denial. Can get stuck here too.

4) Bargaining/guilt. If I do a little of this, the rest will go


5) Acceptance. This is something I need to deal with. What do I

need to do to go forward.

6) Resolve to overcome. Create family normalacy; or overcome

your child's health issue.


If one spouse is stuck and another is at 6, that's where the

conflict starts. You start to see real dissention in a family.


I have some hints for how to get through these stages a little



I mentored a friend. Dad wasn't getting the gf/cf thing, he fed the

child the wrong foods, the child's behaviors were horrible and the

mom had to deal with them. She wanted to make the dad's night


Mary suggested giving dad a night he couldn't forget instead; then

the next morning bring up the gf/cf thing and get him on board.


That worked!

Mary suggested that when the lady and her husband go away on

vacation together, they again have a night to remember. Friday and

Saturday…then Sunday morning bring up the biomedical stuff, and get

him on board.


That worked!


From the other viewpoint, the husband trying to get the wife on

board, give lots of TLC




Q: Will my child ever be able to eat fruit with a serious yeast

issue at present?


A: Fruit is not a problem unless it's eaten in really large

quantities. To help the yeast, control sugars, use antifungal,



Q: My son also loves bananas. You were mentioning them in regards

to the salicylates. Is there something about bananas that would not

be good for him? BTW, what's a vacation!


A: They're not really a salicylate. They do set off behaviors

though. Like demonic laughing, that's usually caused by bananas.

It's not that the bananas are not good for him…but might cause



Q: Did you use Benadryl and/or fever reducers immediately prior to

each IVIG infusion? Any tips on how I can make the IVIG

comfortable for her? What are signs of a bad reaction to the IVIG?


A: One hour prior to IVIG, we got to the appointment. The nurse

applied the EMLA cream. Then benadryl and motrin were both given.

Then he was hydrated heavily. Hopefully the facility where you are

going is well acclimated to dealing with children – tvs, video

games, etc. With the benadryl your child will most likely sleep.

Bad reaction – headache and nausea. That can be mitigated with

benadryl and motrin for next 24 hours. Also a chicken pox type rash

is a less common reaction.


Q: I have two diff questions one would be have you ever met a couple

where the father blames the mom


A: yes, many couples, especially Asian and Hispanic families, the

father blames the mom. Father thinks it's the mom's fault for not

disciplining enough, or thinking about the behaviors too much, or


If you can get your husband to go to the conferences, and be more

involved, maybe that will work, but in many cases you can't get the

husband on board. He's stuck between anger and denial.


Q: How long is the IVIG infusion? I have heard it is something like

6 hours. How do you get a kid to stay put that long?


A: 6 hours is about right. I never saw a child


Q: Does the low dose naltrexone address some of the same immune

issues as IVIG?


A: Nothing is the same as IVIG, not even oral immunoglobulin. LDN

won't do the same thing.


Q: is IVIG permanent or is it a temporary thing that is done

periodically - how many infusions typically. How do you know if your

child qualifies for this treatment



A: IVIG is temporary, in that it lasts 4-6 weeks before you need

another infusion. You want to get to the point where the body can

heal itself. It detoxes the body – heavy metals were coming out like

crazy, because the body started doing what it was supposed to do.

IVIG does exacerbate yeast – stay on antifungals and probiotics.

How many depends on the child, we ended up with 19. Others have

more, less. Depends on the child.

You need to have an immunologist run tests to see if your child



Q: Will this test tell if the child has an immune deficiency?


A: Yes, Dr Gupta is very careful about the patients he takes. He

turns down many who he feels would not benefit.

Again, it's very expensive, priced by the gram.


Q: Any IVIG clinics in Canada - Ontario - Greater Toronto Area??


A: Canada is not real up on IVIG, because they have to pay for it.

The folks I've talked to had to fly to the states for the infusions.


Q: What about baygam as a "cheap" alternative to IVIG?


A: Anything we do to improve the immune system is a good thought. I

do try to caution parents that there is a difference between IVIG

and any other treatment. It's up to each parent to decide what's

best for their child.


Q: Where will your article on relationship challenges be posted?


A: As soon as it gets fully edited I'll let you know.


Q: First, is yeast-free diet a must as long there is a gut-yeast

issue? Next, how do you know that after some number of IVIG

sessions, treatment is enough and can be ended?


A: That was my number one question to Dr Gupta – your child will

either plateau or regress. My child did plateau. At his 18th

infusion, the pediatrician saw no more autism in my son. After that

we did one more, then decided we were done.

On yeast free diet, you're dealing with total dysbiosis of the gut,

so clean the gut as much as possible, but don't go nutty about being

totally sugar-free and carb-free, stay sane along the way.


Q: Did your son have any gut issues?


A: The gut issues were so bad. His poops (20 a day) were like

barnyard animals in the way they looked and smelled. We went to

Krigsman in NY, he diagnosed 2 autoimmune issues in his gut.

We started IVIG because of all the gut issues, but they didn't clear

up all the gut issues, he had to be on meds.


Q: Did you use any chelation therapy prior to the IVIG?


A: We didn't do chelation. It was on my list of things to do..but

when we tested heavy metals, they were all gone. I give credit to

the IVIG.


Q: Do you know how the divorce rate of autistic children affects the



A: I've seen so much of that, a lot of families struggling. It can

really complicate a child's recovery. I try to encourage parents to

work it out.


Q: Do you think IVIG is comparable to MB 12 treatment for

detox/immune function? Which is better?


A: They're different. Detoxing immune is totally different then MB-

12. They can be used in conjunction with eachother. You can also use

antioxidants, like glutathione.


Q: did your son have metals when tested before ivig? What is the

approximate cost for a single IVIG session for approx 40lb kid?

Could you explain the source of IG that is infused into the kid?



A: He had both blood and hair tests, and was off the charts on quite

a few metals. We had to address gut issues before chelation, and

along the way went into IVIG instead of chelation. The IVIG is put

through quite a purification process, it's donations of droplets of

gamma globulin from thousands of donors.


Q: every how often would one do ivig


A: We did every 4 weeks, some go longer.


Q: If you have a child that's a responder to MB-12, does that mean

he's a responder to IVIG?


A: He might benefit. He also might benefit from Tomatis sound

therapy. We did that, and it helped my son's auditory processing





A: yes, you need to choose which version of the sound therapy, AIT,

Tomatis, etc. You need to decide which is best for your child.


Q: If I'm going through a divorce, what was it you said about biomed?


A: If the husband gets a court order, you might be stopped from

doing a biomed treatment that's beneficial. It might also be hard to

get the money from the husband to do the biomed.


Q: Should there be any concern of impurities or issues coming from

others' blood sourced IG? Does insurance pay a part of it?


A: There is a 1 in 1,000,000 chance of a blood borne disease from

IVIG. My sister is a cancer researcher, she asked Dr Gupta about the

process, she felt it was a good process, safe enough for her nephew.

The insurance might pay, especially if autoimmune is suppressed

enough, like missing two antibodies when having titers tested, even

though child was vaxed.


Q: do you have your experience on ivig anywhere on website?


A: We were published, but the magazine sold out of 250,000 copies!

There was so much interest. It was Sept/Oct 2004 Mothering. You can

go on tacanow.com and search Daniel's Story, you should find it. Or

email me and I'll send you the pdf.


Q: did you say if the child did not have 2 titers for vaccines they

received they could qualify for insurance - does this mean the

immune system is not functioning properly when they don't have the



A: Yes, that's what it means, missing 2 means the child is immune



Q: Would a regular pediatrician run that titer test?


A: No, an immunologist.


Q: will Canadian insurance pay for U.S treatment??


A: If you can get Canada to pay for it, let me know. All the

families I mentor are fighting with the bureaucracy, they have not

succeeded in getting it paid for.


Q: How many titers are there to test for?


A: I think there are about a dozen.


Q: How many children recover from this therapy.. And from the dozen

titers if two are missing the therapy is covered.


A: I'm hearing from Dr Gupta it's about 30% recovery rate. He has

narrowed who he accepts as patients.

Yes, if 2 are missing, I'm hearing insurance will pay.

--- End forwarded message ---






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  • 2 weeks later...

Wednesday, August 31, 9:00pm EST


Dr. Stuart H. Freedenfeld

Dr. Freedenfeld has been involved in integrative medicine for the past 20

years. Board certified in family practice since 1978, he has been working

with autistic children using the DAN!T protocols for 9 years.


He will be discussing "practices for Safe Pregnancy", HBOT, and Chelation.



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  • 2 weeks later...

:P A child recently died while receiving IV EDTA. Please excercise extreme caution with use of this product and the qualifications of the Medical Professional who is administering it, especially until more is known about this death

9/12/05 Kim






Dr. Cindy Schneider


Dr. Schneider is a unique healthcare provider who has

established a reputation for responsible and effective

management of patients who have not found relief

through conventional treatment. Her areas of special

interest include innovative nutritional,

environmental, and detoxification interventions for a

variety of complex conditions including autism

spectrum disorders, attention deficit disorders, and a

wide range of autoimmune diseases. As the mother of

two children with autism, Dr. Schneider offers both a

medical and personal assessment of current and

promising treatment options. She has developed and

implemented multiple research studies relating to the

treatment of autism and the identification of genetic

risk factors for neurological disease and remains

committed to advancing our current understanding of

neurodevelopmental disorders through research and

clinical standards of the highest quality.




Dr. Schneider is board certified in obstetrics and

gynecology. Her practice expanded to include the

treatment of individuals with autism and other

developmental disorders in 1995, and has been

exclusively devoted to the treatment of neurological

and immune disorders since 1998. She has been a member

of the Defeat Autism Now! Think Tank since 1997 and

served on the Research Committee of the MIND Institute

at the University of California at Davis from 2001 to

2005. She has developed an extensive database that now

contains detailed medical and developmental histories

on approximately 1000 children with autism spectrum

disorders and utilizes the insight gleaned from this

information to continually improve her approach to



Dr. Schneider was the founding president and medical

director of the Southwest Autism Research Center and

is currently the medical director of the Center for

Autism Research and Education (CARE). She attends

educational courses and conferences monthly and is

committed to expanding her knowledge base and clinical

skills throughout her career.




Q: My son is a picky eater with a limited diet. He has

multiple food allergies/intolerances, is on a gfcf,

soy and nut free diet and is very thin for his age.

He's 11 and only 58 lbs. He is a bit above average for

height. Any suggestions on how to get him to gain

some weight? Thanks He has no gut issues, never had BM



A: Is he weight so low because he’s refusing foods?

(answer – he’s very active as well as very picky) He

has a poor intake but is able to be active, so that’s

a positive. Even if they don’t have obvious diarrhea,

constipation, reflux, etc, it probably is still worth

getting an endoscopy. Has he ever seen a

gastroenterologist or had someone look for

inflammation of the gut? (answer – yes, years ago,

2003, they saw problems with the mucosal lining of the

stomach and small intestines, gastritis) So even

though there are no obvious signs, he does have

inflammation, probably still has it since he isn’t

gaining weight and is a picky eater. What have you

tried in the way of supplements/diets? (answer –

inositol, no glucosamine) N-acetyl glucosamine is very

helpful in healing the gut. Also MB-12 helps, and the

diet. For the size of your child, 500 mg 2x a day. You

should see some healing. Another intervention that

might help is intravenous glutathione. If there is

chronic inflammation, you might want to do genetic

testing, see if he has normal glutathione genes.

(answer- we are doing IV glutathione, 600 mg, every 9

weeks, also secretin Secraflo) With the kind of

inflammation you’re describing you might be better off

doing it weekly. I like to bring the inflammation down

first with glutathione; then use secretin. Secraflo is

the preferred brand, as far as I’m concerned, for

safety. You might also try the transdermal glutathione

from AMT in between if you can’t get the IV more then

every 9 weeks. If it turns out genetic testing shows

there are problems with glutathione production, try

the IV and/or TD glutathione. (answer – reduced

glutathione is low, cysteine is normal, dr thinks he

has GST 1 defect based on test results; no yeast

issues; not sure of taurine levels) Also if you have a

feeding specialist in the area, they can work on him

with his diet, and help with oral motor. In summary,

best option is IV glutathione, if you can’t do that

frequently TD glutathione; also probiotics and MB-12.

Also could consider oral gammaglobulin.


Q: I have enquiry re EDTA. We were having great

success with iv EDTA and am now looking for

alternative to iv while on hold . Would appreciate

your thoughts on effectiveness of td-EDTA also CAEDTA

in bath and Cilantro /Chlorella as a "reroute" to

accessing lead. Thank you. Have you done any TDEDTA

challenges??. OK and while I'm here what about

really low motor tone and lead issues very tall child

won’t pick up a pen, can't jump or run. Do you think

these are lead toxicity type issues???


A: I’ve had very good results with IV calcium EDTA.

Lead comes out first, then I see cadmium, mercury and

other metals come out. It’s shocking to see how much

lead is a problem to my patients. I have tried TD

EDTA, I’m not happy with it, they can’t seem to

concentrate the formula, it’s messy, smelly, you have

to apply 3 x a day. I do use a lot of the Beyond

Clear, the EDTA you put in the bathwater. I have not

done studies on that bath water EDTA however, so I

don’t know how much metal is coming out. I don’t have

experience with cilantro and chlorella – I’ve heard

from other doctors it’s not all that effective. We did

a couple challenges on TD EDTA, not a lot came out;

but then again I didn’t see a lot come out with TD

DMPS challenges either. The calcium EDTA challenge

showed a lot more. I get the sense that TD DMPS is

slow and gradual, as you go on you see better



Q: What precautions and preventive measures can be

taken during pregnancy and after delivery by mother

and baby to prevent autism?


A: I thought I knew what to do to have as healthy a

baby as possible, being an ob/gyn. I was always very

conservative – avoid caffeine, alcohol, etc. You

should look at your health very carefully before

considering another pregnancy. Consider autoimmune;

deal with amalgams; COMT testing and other testing

that is for children on the spectrum; if you have

MB-12 defect, consider taking that yourself; essential

fatty acids; probiotics. Avoid flu shot. If you have

to have rhogam get the thimerosal-free version. If

you’re RH-, have husband tested, if he’s RH- too you

don’t need to have the rhogam shot.

After delivery, if you have one or more children on

the spectrum already, avoid gluten/dairy for this

child, and become well-informed on vaccines before

making the decision to get them. I wouldn’t chelate

someone who is pregnant, but I have chelated women

before they get pregnant.


Q: Have you heard of using Nebulized Glutathione to

help with detoxification of metals while doing



A: I’ve heard of it, but am afraid to use it. There

could be some downsides, rare but serious, since it’s



Q: my son has lymphonodular hyperplasia, gastritis,

colitis; found it because he was anemic from all the

blood loss through the stool -- could you please just

briefly list off the treatments you recommended for

Barb in the first question, so that i can write them

down? thank you so much!


A: Heal the gut – MB-12; folapro; n-acetyl

glucosamine; good probiotics; gluten/casein free and

any other allergens; essential fatty acids (introduce

these later on in healing process). For those that

don’t respond to these, there’s IV glutathione,

secretin, gammaglobulin. I’ve been using n-acetyl

glucosamine for years now, usually have a very good



Q: I'm a very picky eater adult. I gag with several

foods. I have tourette syndrome & also have multiple

food/pollens/molds/dust allergies. I have bad

candida. I notice tics are a lot less when I avoid

the foods I'm allergic to. I can't seem to get on a

gluten/casein free diet because I'm still such a picky

eater. My fruits are limited to 2 fruits and one I'm

allergic to. My vegetables are limited to 3 and I'm

allergic to one of those. Also I get really bad

cravings for dairy products and bread. Do you have

any suggestions?


A: Most of the tourette patients I have are very

sensitive to dairy. Follow the diet as strictly as you

can, most of the time the diet helps. In terms of

allergies, if you’ve done things to heal gut, you

might be able to reintroduce foods that you couldn’t

tolerate before. Cravings indicate that it’s a

intolerance still.


Q: My daughter is x, Dr. Neubrander is her DAN!. You

left a very encouraging message on my answering

machine re: IV EDTA and I listened to it everyday

before she had her IV. The IV went well, she did get

pale and sleepy afterward. Is there any reason why a

child would not be a good candidate for IV EDTA and

what can we expect after IV - such as sleepiness,

etc.? Should a child on IV EDTA take any special or

extra supplementation?


A: Adults report some fatigue, some achiness, but not

often. That might be from calcium and magnesium

depletion, which we can easily supplement. I use red

blood cell element testing, prior to any chelation at

all. If there are low levels of minerals, we replenish

before starting chelation. CBC, thyroid and other

usual tests are done prior to chelation as well.


Q: My son has a huge appetite. He wants to eat a meal

every hour from 6 am until 5 pm and will scream and

bang his head if not fed. He eats huge amounts of

food, all healthy, GFCF but the quantity is huge. He

has had bad stool bacteria for over a year. We tried

treating it with the antibiotics on the stool test and

he lost lots of language. I have tried megadoses of

tons of good quality probiotics with no effect, lots

of herbals , most of which he does not tolerate. His

OAT is clean and his other stool markers are good

except not enough good bacteria. Is there any other

way to approach the bacterial problem? Should I try

NAG? Does it ever have negative side effects? Thanks!


A: Does he have frequent stools? Sounds like he might

have a malabsorption issue. (answer – he does not have

frequent stools, actually infrequent) How bad is his

constipation? If you address that, you might solve

your other problems. You might want to re-do a stool

test, see if inflammation is a problem. You might need

to address that. Otherwise address constipation. NAG

does work; but you can try buffered vitamin C and

magnesium taurate. Both help clear up constipation.


Q: What is your opinion on Saunas for detoxification?

And also, which High quality probiotics do you

recemmend? My son has major yeast issues (aribinose

and hippuric acid on oat test were high) and I am

going nuts with his various diets (gfcfsf), but his

behavior gets out of control. His stools smell nasty

but are pretty firm, and he goes everyday (sorry for

the detail).


A: I do recommend far infrared saunas. Start with just

5 minutes for a child, see how he/she tolerates. It

helps with pesticide exposure and many other

chemicals, not just heavy metals. It’s not affordable

however for some families. I prefer Claire Probiotic

Complete, they ship it in perfect condition. There are

other vendors with good products, but if they’re

shipped warm, that kills the bacteria. You have to

look at sugar intake, how constipated he is, in

addition to the good probiotics. Hopefully you’ll see

good results.


Q: Do you have any opinions on lead wrt to maternal

load affecting the fetal sink. Have you challenged

any Mum's . ??? How long do you feel these children

will require lead "extraction' given it is stored in

the bones and what would your long term protocol be

assuming some time in the future we will be able to

resume iv EDTA. Were you giving weekly iv EDTA

biweekly??? Thanks again


A: I agree, we will never totally clear our toxic

metal load. We do need to decrease the volume to

increase our chance of having healthy children. Any

toxic metals could potentially cross the placenta and

go to the fetus. More often then not, moms are pretty

toxic. My hobbies used to be making stained glass

windows (solder, lead, etc); and I worked my way

through school in chemistry labs. How often for EDTA

depends on the individual and their mineral status.


Q: My 17yr old son sees a conventional metabolic and

GI specialist. He has had obvious mercury exposures

and complications w/Rhogam along with other things.

He has problems detoxifying in general (enzymes).

My question is what is the best test for mercury in

order to evaluate justification for IV EDTA?


A: I’m not sure what you’re basing your statements on

– have you done a hair analysis, urine test,

challenge? Or are you guessing based on vaccines? You

can try any chelating agent, and collect urine

afterwards. EDTA is a viable option if you see high

lead. There are very high lead levels in the patients

I’ve tested. We’re dealing with kids that have very

poor detox capabilities – they accumulate all heavy

metals, whatever they’ve been exposed to.


Q: I had my amalgams removed a couple months ago. I

started on mb12 injections about 2 weeks ago. I plan

on starting tddmps in about 3 weeks. Today I started

having achy legs, which I had a couple weeks ago, but

it went away. Is this likely to be a possible detox

symptom? As far as magnesium I'm taking a supplement

that has 100 mg of Magnesium (as Glycinate) and 546 mg

of Magnesium Glycinate. How much magnesium does it

actually contain?


A: Monitor red blood cell elements. If you have achy

legs, you’re most likely deficient in minerals,

calcium, magnesium. Magnesium taurate and citrate are

my preferences for magnesium, moreso then glycinate.


Q: 1. Should a pregnant woman who already has an

autistic child be on gluten-free, dairy-free diet

during pregnancy and nursing period? 2. Is chelation

using DMPS-IV regularly every month ok for a 6-yr old

boy? as he was not tolerating more than 2 drops of

td-dmps, huge stimming and regression. 3. Any other

chelator suggestions? He had 8 rounds of oral dmsa

when 3yrs old but stopped becaue of yeast and

increased liver enzymes.


A: Yes, I do recommend moms be gf/cf/cornfree/soyfree

during pregnancy. I recommend breastfeeding. Avoid

things like MSG, artificial coloring too.

IV-DMPS I don’t use, I know it can be used in the

proper hands, but there are more side effects reported

from this so I don’t use it. If your child doesn’t

tolerate 2 drops of TD-DMPS, I certainly wouldn’t go

to IV-DMPS. There must be something about the DMPS

that your child is sensitive to. There is oral EDTA as

an option, since he’s not tolerating DMPS or DMSA.


Q: My daughter is 6 and non-verbal autistic. We are

using TD-DMPS dr buttars protocol for almost 5 months

and TD-ALA for 3 weeks now. She has made improvements

but still no language. I want to continue but my

hubby is loosing faith in chelation. How long before

we say it will not help her learn to speak? And have

other treatments like Hyperbarics and FIR sauna's help

as well? What form of Glutathione do you suggest we

look into?


A: What else are you doing? I have heard good reports

with hyperbaric in select cases, and I mentioned FIR

sauna before. Are you not seeing metals come out?

(answer – small amounts) You might want to try a

different chelation agent. Maybe mercury isn’t the

primary problem for your daughter.


Q: We are almost a year on TD-DMPS and have not seen

noticeable improvement. Do we continue? Could we

take a break until we have done more EDTA's? We have

done 3 IV-EDTA's and have seen good results -

increased awareness. Could the previous poster’s

child not be sensitive to the gsh in the TD-DMPS, not

the DMPS? My guy could not tolerate the gsh in the

IV-EDTA so we leave it out, although he does tolerate

the lipo glut. so we use small amounts of that



A: There is always a possibility that the child can be

sensitive to glutathione. I saw one. Ordinarily it’s

tolerated well. If you’ve done a year of DMPS and see

no improvement, yes, consider switching to another

agent, consider oral EDTA.


Q: I have amalgams, and I apply td-dmps on my son to

remove his mercury. After applying the td-dmps (I use

a glass to apply it on his skin), I sometimes get

headaches which last for days. Can my headaches be

caused by the td-dmps which I give to my son?


A: Did you have headaches before you started your

son’s TD-DMPS? Perhaps it’s from the little bit you’re

inhaling. If you’re that sensitive to it, I wonder how

sensitive your son is to it. Ask someone else to apply

it on your son, see if that solves your problem.


Q: Hi Dr. Schneider. My 4 year old son receives 20 mg

of magnesium glycinate in his multi vitamin. He is

chelating with TD DMSA. I have tried to add

additional magnesium glycinate and recently magnesium

citrate and he becomes noticeably irritable and less

focused. When I pull the extra magnesium, he is making

real strides. Any thoughts?


A: You should test minerals to see what magnesium

level is. Does he have loose stools, or is

constipated? Glycinate is not my first choice – I like

mag citrate or taurate. (answer – bowel movements

daily, somewhat loose)


Q: I have extremely high levels of uranium and high

levels of arsenic. How does one get high levels of

uranium? Is it pesticide related? I grew up on a

farm. Is tddmps effective methods for these?


A: I see high levels of uranium in quite a few of my

patients. I know it’s naturally occurring in the soil

in some parts of the country. Also can be a product of

nuclear reaction. It might also be pesticide related.

I have seen TD-DMPS help with the arsenic; I don’t

know that it’s that effective for the uranium.


Q: I have a 2 1/2 year old daughter - has had a

history of sensitivity to treatments - ie: was a great

responder to MB-12 but had huge side effects that were

only cleared up after months on SCD - she had an oral

DMPS challenge that found only high mercury - DAN Dr

recommended trying NDF PLus - and she had a reaction

almost immediately - first stimming off the charts and

within a day speech regression - I stopped the

treatment - would you suggest trying again at a

smaller dose or maybe exploring other options? Thanks


A: You said she was a great responder to MB-12 – what

were the huge side effects? (answer – panic attacks,

sleep disturbances, aggressive biting) Have you done

genetic testing? (answer – no) That might shed some

light on this. If she’s had very strong negative

reactions, I wouldn’t repeat them – the NDF +, etc.

I’d look into other options instead. Have you seen

results with LDN? (answer – yes, great changes in her

ABA sessions, more willingness to learn). So continue

MB-12 since she’s good with it now, and continue LDN.


Q: Why did the b 12 shots not work for us? We tried

everything Dr N said to do and still no results. My

daughter is non-verbal, autistic. She’s 6. She is

constipated. We’ve used mag citrate, glycinate,

sennekot, little tummies, miralax, enemas and



A: Try buffered C, like Bioenergy C which you mix in

juice or water. Suplement with magnesium. Epsom salt

baths. Enemas. Probiotics, EFAs, n-acetyl glucosamine.

(answer – we’ve done all that) How much vit C is your

child taking. (answer 500 mg) Use buffered C, use ½

tsp 2x day, and work up as needed, until you see

improvement in her stools. Monitor sugar intake. Once

you can clear up constipation, you’ll see other things

fall into place.


Q: 1) Does oral EDTA remove mercury effectively? 2)

Also, you mentioned genetic MT Testing, is it

Metallothionein? If MT deficient, then should MTP be

taken for a while before conception?


A: 1) Truthfully most of my experience has been with

IV EDTA. EDTA clears mercury, but clears lead first.

2) I think it’s helpful for any woman considering

pregnancy to know if she would benefit from MB-12 and

Folapro. I don’t think I would use the MTP during

pregnancy. Do a red blood cell test to check zinc,

selenium, so forth.


Q: My son was on TD-DMPS for 8 months. We tested him

before chelation and at 7 months. He was excreting

some mercury and tons of lead in urine and stool

before chelation and at 7 months he was not excreting

anymore mercury in urine and less lead. He was also

shaking his hands a lot. Why would this be? There

were no big improvements but he was more affectionate

during chelation starting the first week. I want to

chelate again at a low dose. Should I consider a

different schedule than every other day?


A: Have you been following mineral levels, and is he

on MB-12? (answer – we supplement lots of zinc) You

should still test, and check other levels –calcium,

magnesium, selenium. The shaking of the hands might

have to do with remyelination (nerves regenerating,

this feels like tingling). Keep him on MB-12.

If the main problem seems to be lead, you might try

oral EDTA at this point.

Definitely check mineral levels – you don’t want to

oversupplement with zinc either.


Q: I had my amino acids tested and certain ones were

high. Gamma-Aminobutyric Acid, Taurine, a-Aminoadipic

Acid, Aspartic Acid, Citrulline, Glutamine, Anserine,

B-Alanine, 1-Methylhistidine, Arachidonic,

Docosatetraenoic, Arachidic, Behenic, Pentadecanoic,

Heptadecanoic, Nonadecanoic, and Total C:18 Trans. My

Isoleucine was low. It suggested several supplements

which most of them I'm familiar with except for a-KG.

Could you explain what a-KG does?


A: The high arachidonic usually means there is

inflammation. Do you have arthritis, sinusitis,

inflammation in the gut, asthma? (answer – candida and

allergies) I am not very fond of alpha keta glurorate

(a-KG) – it can cause irritability. It can be

beneficial in some cases, but I found it’s not

well-tolerated in a significant percentage, so I don’t

use it.


Q: If an autistic child has high IGG antibodies for a

certain food, should that food be completely avoided,

or limited? How often should we do these IGG tests

during chelation to check if the removal of mercury is

healing the immune system ?


A: IgG is one way to look for allergies, though not my

favorite way. I would completely eliminate the foods

that have high IgG reactions. Avoid them until you’re

convinced there is significant healing of the gut. If

you reintroduce the food before the gut is healed,

you’re back to square one. Rotate the foods that there

are no sensitivities. Reintroduce foods one at a time

when the child is healthy, things are stable. The

child may have outgrown the sensitivity.


Q: You mentioned earlier that you thought Nebulized

Glutathione had too many risks involved> We want to

use it for our 6 year old autistic non-verbal

daughter. What kind of side effects are you talking

about and are they permanent damages? As I mentioned

we are using TD-DMPS and TD-ALA and want to enhance

her detoxification of mercury and other metals. My

friend said her son became very hyper on oral

glutathione. Would you suggest using transdermal for

this as well? We can't find anyone locally who will

use this in IV form and I am nervous about using IV



A: I have not used it personally. Some kids that don’t

cooperate with IV might benefit from it…but I’ve heard

of asthma reactions, which could be life-threatening.

That’s why I avoid it. If your child has asthma,

definitely don’t try it.

I don’t recommend oral glutathione, it’s poorly

absorbed. Try transdermal – start with low dose to

make sure it’s tolerated.


Q: 1. Who is a good candidate for MTP? 2. What

improvements and side effects can be expected? 3. What

is the general usage protocol and how long should it

generally be used? 4. What are good sources of fat on

gfcf diet, what is your opinion on ghee ? 5. What is

your opinion on blood thinners like nattokinase to

enable blood flow to brain?


A: Metallothionein promoter? It’s not always

tolerated, causes irritability. I supplement zinc and

B vitamins separately and don’t use the MT promoter.

If a child has pyroluria, they will have to always

supplement minerals.

I prefer olive oil for good fat. I stay away from corn

and soy oil, these kids shouldn’t have it. I stay away

from cottonseed oil, high in pesticide. I don’t think

these kids could tolerate ghee. I might allow organic

ghee (clarified butter) if the child is ready to have

it reintroduced. It’s certainly preferable to


Blood thinners are effective. I don’t use them in

children. I’ve seen dramatic improvement in adults.


Q: What is your protocol for testing and treating for



A: I use the standard 3-day digestive stool analysis.

I’m fairly aggressive in treating parasites with

traditional and non-traditional means. I do use some

homeopathy, but I’m not a homepath. Some remedies have

been helpful to my family, so I am learning about it

and implementing it in small amounts.


Q: my daughter drinks very little fluids - what do you

recommend for children like this?


A: I prefer she drink water instead of juices. For

kids that won’t drink, try ice chips, or popsicles

made from juice. Sometimes kids prefer broths. Bathe

them frequently; they’ll get some absorption through

the skin. Enemas with filtered water will make them

absorb water through the rectum, if they are really



Q: I've been using vitamin therapy for 8 years and

still a year ago I had vitamin deficiencies in

calcium, b5, and vitamin c. I also have pyroluria.

I'm going to get the red blood cell elements test

done. If I still have deficiencies is it suggested

that I still start chelation or do I need to get these

deficiencies in control first? Do the deficiencies

ever go away?

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Tuesday September 13, 9:00pm EST

Amy L. Lansky, PhD


Over ten years ago, computer research scientist Amy Lansky began a

journey to try and help her three-year-old autistic son Max. She

found the answer in Homeopathy. As Max gradually made a complete

recovery, she began to study this alternative therapy and eventually

became a practitioner herself. Her best-selling Impossible Cure: The

Promise of Homeopathy (R.L. Ranch Press, 2003,

http://www.impossiblecure.com) describes the history, philosophy,

and science of homeopathic medicine, and includes the story of her

son's cure along with dozens of first-person testimonials of cures

for a variety of physical, mental, and emotional conditions.


Amy Lansky graduated from the University of Rochester in 1977 with

degrees in mathematics and computer science, and received her

doctorate in computer science from Stanford University in 1983.

After many years working at various Silicon Valley research

institutions in the area of artificial intelligence (including SRI

International, NASA Ames Research Center, and three years as a

consulting associate professor at Stanford), she made an unusual

career move: she became a student, writer, promoter, and, most

recently, practitioner of homeopathic medicine. This was prompted by

the miraculous cure of her son's autism with homeopathy. Lansky now

speaks and writes widely about homeopathy in general and especially

its role as a treatment for autism. She is an executive board of the

National Center for Homeopathy in Alexandria, Virginia. A health-

freedom advocate, she is also an executive board member of the

California Health Freedom Coalition, the organization that sponsored

SB-577, the California health freedom bill that was passed in

September 2002.


You can learn more about homeopathic treatment of autism by visiting

http://www.impossiblecure.com or by listening to Amy's monthly radio

show on AutismOne Radio -- http://www.autismone.org/radio -- at 2pm

EST the 3rd Friday of each month. Archives of old shows are

available at www.impossiblecure.com.



To download the biochat software, goto www.drneubrander.com to the

chat/forum tab.

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Amy L. Lansky, PhD

Over ten years ago, computer research scientist Amy

Lansky began a journey to try and help her

three-year-old autistic son Max. She found the answer

in Homeopathy. As Max gradually made a complete

recovery, she began to study this alternative therapy

and eventually became a practitioner herself. Her

best-selling Impossible Cure: The Promise of

Homeopathy (R.L. Ranch Press, 2003,

http://www.impossiblecure.com) describes the history,

philosophy, and science of homeopathic medicine, and

includes the story of her son's cure along with dozens

of first-person testimonials of cures for a variety of

physical, mental, and emotional conditions.


Amy Lansky graduated from the University of Rochester

in 1977 with degrees in mathematics and computer

science, and received her doctorate in computer

science from Stanford University in 1983. After many

years working at various Silicon Valley research

institutions in the area of artificial intelligence

(including SRI International, NASA Ames Research

Center, and three years as a consulting associate

professor at Stanford), she made an unusual career

move: she became a student, writer, promoter, and,

most recently, practitioner of homeopathic medicine.

This was prompted by the miraculous cure of her son's

autism with homeopathy. Lansky now speaks and writes

widely about homeopathy in general and especially its

role as a treatment for autism. She is an executive

board of the National Center for Homeopathy in

Alexandria, Virginia. A health-freedom advocate, she

is also an executive board member of the California

Health Freedom Coalition, the organization that

sponsored SB-577, the California health freedom bill

that was passed in September 2002.


You can learn more about homeopathic treatment of

autism by visiting http://www.impossiblecure.com or by

listening to Amy's monthly radio show on AutismOne

Radio -- http://www.autismone.org/radio -- at 2pm EST

the 3rd Friday of each month. Archives of old shows

are available at www.impossiblecure.com.






Q: Hi, I believe my son has had multiple reactions to

vaccines. The he definitely had an immediate reaction

to his set of two flu vaccines. Do you feel that this

is primarily because of mercury, or possibly the flu

virus itself?. Also, with the cold/flu season

approaching. Do you have any recommendations for

keeping kids healthy, and fending off colds?


A: I believe that most of the autism epidemic is

caused by vaccines, both the mercury in vaccines and

the fact that there are so many vaccines given.

There’s an excellent article in Mothering Magazine by

Richard Pitt about homeopathy. There is a lot of hype

about the flu vaccine. Homeopathy has an amazing track

record of treating the flu. Go to the homeopathic.org

website – there are great tips there to treat the flu.

Skip the vaccines, they’re a bad idea. Especially if

your child is already vaccine-damaged.


Q: Hi Amy and thank you for being here. For someone

fairly new to homeopathy where is the best place to

start with a 3.5 yr. old with autism? We are currently

doing some bio medical interventions. Will that

interfere with homeopathic remedies? and are there

ever any negative side effects from homeopathic

remedies? thank you


A: The best place to start is to learn on your own.

Read my book Impossible Cure ( www.impossiblecure.com)

; also the book by the Ullmann’s that just came out –

A Drug Free Approach to Aspergers and Autism.

Most biomedical interventions will not interfere with

homeopathy. The homeopathy will certainly not

interfere with them. Chelation will probably interfere

with homeopathy. If you’re dead set on chelation, you

might try that first, but you might find it’s not

necessary once you start with homeopathy.


Q: Amy can you explain what are the different

definitions for classical, clinical, and sequential



A: Classical is what my book discusses. Classical is

what is defined by the founder, Hahnemann. Homeo means

similar, pathy means suffering. You want to find a

remedy that’s associated with the symptoms of the

child. Healthy people take the remedy, find out what

symptoms it causes. EG Coffee causes sleeplessness,

heart palpitations, insomnia in a healthy person. The

homeopathic remedy would match those symptoms.

Clinical homeopathy refers to isopathic – child

damaged by vaccine, so you give the vaccine in

potency, or the thimerosal in potency.

Sequential homeopathy is a philosophy in which you

treat everything that happened to the patient in

reverse order. EG first surgery, then vaccination,

then your mother died. So you get grief remedy, then

flu remedy, then remedy for the effects of the

surgery. My view is that’s a bit of a mechanical

approach, people don’t generally work that way.

A classical homeopath will include clinical and

sequential in their practice. If they only get so far

in classical, ie find a block, they might go to an

isopathic remedy to clear a vaccine, for example.


Q: Do you recommend Chiropractic care for children as

a form a treatment for Autism. How do you feel about

cranial sacral therapy for treating autism versus just

relieving subluxations at the chiropractor?


A: I think manipulative therapies are really good,

particularly cranial sacral and osteopathic. In my

experience, I follow the practitioners that treat

autistic kids, they say their cases go much faster if

the kids are getting osteopathic/cranial sacral. These

therapies don’t interfere with homeopathy, and do

boost eachother’s effect.


Q: Last time homeopaths were on Biochat, there were a

lot of words defined with other words like miasms and

similums, and I didn’t get an idea of how the

homeopathic treatments work. Can you explain how

homeopathy works in the body.


A: Miasms is an advanced subject, I took it out of my


The law of similars – coffee example – states that to

treat a person with a set of symptoms you give them a

remedy from a substance that can also cause those

symptoms. Physical and mental symptoms.

Samuel Hahnemann was having difficulty curing some

diseases, and realized he had to treat things at a

deeper level. He discovered often the disease

progression begins with a particular disease

(gonorrhea, syphilis, tuberculosis, etc). Then he

realized there was a way to categorize remedies in

general classes –miasms are broader categorizations of

disease states. If he chose a remedy in the right

miasm, he found he had better results.

EG With tuberculosis, there are respiratory problems,

and it might run in the family. To get rid of the

chronic lung infection, you have to treat the miasm.

Sometimes it’s treated by using a remedy made from the

disease tuberculosis. Hahnemann felt there are 3

miasms, others feel there are up to 8 miasms.


Q: Have you heard of Bioray's NDF+? What do you think

of this natural chelator, and have you seen things

like this work? Like milk thistle, chlorella?


A: I’m not an expert on chelation, I don’t do

biomedical treatments. My instinct is the natural

chelators would interfere less with homeopathy.


Q: You said that chelation might hinder homeopathic

treatment. Can you explain this in more detail? I

don't understand.



A: I say this based on stories I’ve heard. I know of

cases where the child was progressing nicely with

homeopathic treatment, the mom got impatient and

started chelation; all the gains were lost from the

homeopathy. In the end the child was set back for

about a year, and now the child is back with

homeopathy and making progress again.

I’ve heard this from other homeopaths too. If you’re

seeing slow but sure progress, stick with the


Homeopathic literature indicates that it can chelate

metals from the body. There is a story in my book

about a person who worked in an orchard and was dying

from arsenic poisoning. Within an hour of taking the

remedy, he sweated out huge amounts of arsenic.

Another case was of a dental hygienist who started

excreting mercury in her menstrual flow.

So homeopathy doesn’t force a biochemical change in

your body like a drug – it stimulates your body into

helping itself. It will happen at the rate that the

body can naturally handle it.


Q: Is this a much easier way of treating the child

rather than chelating? What is the success rate?


A: I wouldn’t call it easy. Chelation, you see the

results with testing, it’s a fixed form of treatment.

Homeopathy is a more involved process. You have to

find a good, experienced homeopath. Then the homeopath

has to find the correct remedy for your child, and

that’s a total individual thing. Each child gets a

different remedy based on their symptoms. It takes

time – several months – to get any results usually.

Years of recovery time. But the homeopaths are getting

really good results, very striking noticeable changes

in autistic kids. The success rate for these

homeopaths are 50-75%. Some get complete recovery,

like my son, no residual symptoms – that happens in

about 5% of the cases.


Q: What homeopathic protocol/remedy did you follow

for curing your son's Autism. How old was your son

when you started to see improvements and how old was

he when he was completely recovered?


A: We brought my son to the homeopath when he was 3.5

(this is before all the biomed stuff was well known,

and I was groping in the dark). The only thing we had

done prior to homeopathy was food elimination, based

on Feingold. My son was totally addicted to milk. That

was when he started speaking. That was when he was 3.

He was in speech and language therapy. We also

eliminated food coloring, corn. He was speaking but

had echolalia, was autistic. We hit the right remedy

immediately. In a week, his therapists noticed a

shift. Within 9 months, the therapist felt he didn’t

need treatment any more. Within a year and a half, he

was testing normally (age 5) and was released from

eligibility for special ed. He was 80% - there was

still social awkwardness, not completely responsive

all the time, etc. We felt out of the woods, in

another 3-4 years. So this was like a 5 year process.


Q: How long usually takes to see the improvement by

homeopathic approach?


A: Once the homeopath finds the correct remedy, you

should see something within a month. If you see

nothing, you have to change the remedy. There are some

remedies that take longer, say 2 months. You might see

changes within a day or a week. You might notice the

child reaching out for more contact, more eye contact.

Even if it’s very subtle. Don’t expect your child to

have a full recovery in two weeks.


Q: I'll admit I don't understand homeopathy very well

– I’m just learning about it - but I’m terrified when

a remedy contains tetanus. Can you ease my thoughts?




A: My son’s first remedy was made from cancer. My

homeopath told me that. I was taken aback.

But all the remedies are so dilute that not even a

single molecule of whatever it’s made from is in the

remedy. Also if you’re eating chicken, you might be

eating cancer…you can’t get the disease from eating


Lots of remedies made from disease matter – you

wouldn’t find any of that disease matter if you tested

the remedy.

Homeopathy is completely and utterly benign compared

to conventional medicine.

If you start taking a remedy in high quantities over

and over, you might start getting the symptoms that

that remedy could cause.

You need to find a homeopath that knows what they’re


Once you discontinue a remedy, the symptoms usually go

away quickly.



Q: Do rashes mean that a remedy is working? Will

there always be improvements with rashes? Also, is it

ever helpful to treat the parents and discover their

constitutions in order to help discover the child's

correct remedy, especially if the child is non-verbal?


A: Rashes can often mean the remedy is helping. This

is discussed in my book at length. If the disease

began with an external rash and went inwards, if you

see that rash coming out it’s good news, a good sign.

Your homeopath can help assess that.

It’s very helpful if parents go to the homeopath too,

along with their children. If you’re treated, it will

provide a better atmosphere for your family. That will

help in your child’s recovery too. You’re going

through so much anxiety, worry, etc. It can only help

if the parents get treated as well.


Q: Does the Homeopath need to see the child often? or

can this be done long distance?


A: If you can find a good homeopath nearby, I always

recommend that, esp for the very first appointment.

You don’t have to go that often. If you’re local,

maybe once every 2 months, especially in the initial

stages. If you are trying to work long distance,

ideally go once a year.


Q: Are you familiar with bioplasma or essential cell

salts? Are they useful?


A: Most classical homeopaths don’t use cell salts.

They are low potency, made from mineral salts in your

body. Some homepaths feel they’re like vitamins. But I

feel they are powerful in their own right, and don’t

advise their use in my practice.


Q: My son was given 3 remedies at the same time (to

detox), these caused his cough, fever and running nose

but after that nothing happened. Would that be an

indication of correct remedy not found yet? (you said,

and also the practitioner said it too, that it is a

good sign)


A: I don’t normally give 3 remedies at once to detox.

It might be a good sign…but the question is what

happened next. If a month and a half has gone by, I’d

say give it another month. It sounds like the

homeopath is not classical, you might go back in

another month.


Q: We’ve seen great things with MB-12. What is your

philosophy about homeopathy and the mb-12 phenomenon?

In most of the kids we’ve seen there is a problem with

the pathway. By injecting the vitamin, we get past the



A: Homeopathy should correct the underlying problem in

the body, so you wouldn’t need the supplement/vitamin

anymore. Here’s another example, milk was aggravating

my son, we took it out of his diet. Over time, his

food sensitivity went away. Hopefully with the

homeopathy, the child’s need for mb-12 will decrease

as the child improves.


Q: Can a strong die-off reaction from probiotics

interfere with homeopathy?


A: I don’t think that would interfere. But definitely

tell the homeopath what you’re doing, so he/she can

adjust your dosing.


Q: I’m informed that the homeopathy can be added to

biomed treatments except that it dislikes the

aggressive chelations, any other factors we need to

consider in order to combine these 2 approaches



A: Yes, I would guess that they could be combined.

Another thing that could interfere would be a strong

oil, like oil of oregano. Sometimes things that are

very strong can antidote the remedy. The remedies

operate on a fine energetic level. Things like

drinking coffee can antidote the remedy, it’s too much

input. It depends totally on the person. Some people

can drink coffee while they’re doing homeopathy, some

not. If you’re going along fine and improving, and you

take a substance and you get worse or it stops

working, you can suspect the remedy was antidoted.

There are ways around this. You can change dosing. I

might give a low potency every day so they can get

around the antidote effect.

It’s possible that daily dosing might work better for

someone doing a lot of strong biomedical treatments.


Q: what would the average cost of homeopath be?


A: In general they will charge by the hour at about

the same rate as a therapist, 100-150/hour. Usually

the first appointment is the longest, 1-3 hours. You

might spend 2-300 on the first appointment. A followup

is usually like ½ hour. The remedies cost essentially

nothing, either very cheap or sometimes free with the

appointment. Typical price for a remedy is $10.


Q: is it caffeine in general that would antidote; or

specifically coffee?


A: It’s specifically the coffee – tea or coke would be



Q: Do people usually avoid mint toothpaste completely

during homeopathy?


A: Personally I don’t think it’s a problem. Some

doctors are very strict about that…but I have never

avoided it.

Coffee is sometimes a problem; Camphor and eucalyptus

and tea tree oil, Vick’s vapor rub. These are all

effective antidotes.


Q: Amy have you ever heard of Native Remedies brand?

they use the homeopathic approach for treating

autism/add etc etc


A: I’m not familiar with it, no. But I can tell you

Hahnemann Labs in US is very good. In England Helios

Pharmacy is good. There are lots of other good

suppliers. National Center for Homeopathy is a good

site www.homeopathic.org


Q: Dear Dr Lansky , Can you pls. tell us about Zincum


how can it help increase zinc levels?

My child has the symptoms. Is it recommeded to take

Zincum Metallicum to increase blood zinc level?



A: Zinc is a remedy. It can help autistic kids.

However, it should not be used as a vitamin. It’s

inadvisable to view a homeopathic remedy as a vitamin.

If you don’t have the symptoms that zinc metallicum

has, and you take it regularly like a vitamin, you

could potentially get the symptoms. Go to a materia

medica online and look up the zinc to see what the

symptoms are.

It will help your body regulate itself, so if it

works, it would cause your body to improve the zinc



Q: Are you familiar with Dandi Comp Liver,

gallbladder, and hydrate I remedies? What are your

thoughts on these?


A: These sound like organ support remedies. They’re

often used as organ support. If you’re using a good

homeopath, I’d say it’s ok, someone familiar with

organ support remedies.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Dr. John Green


John Green, M.D. graduated from the University of

Idaho in 1970 with degrees in psychology and

chemistry. He graduated from the University of Utah

Medical School in 1974 and completed a rotating

internship at the University of New Mexico in 1975.

From 1975 to 1980 he was Medical Director of Emergency

Services at Tulare District Hospital, Tulare

California, with a concurrent part-time general

practice in preventative medicine and environmental

medicine, allergies and the nutritional, emotional,


and belief systems factors of chronic illness. Since

1980, he has continued in environmental and holistic

medicine. In 1999 he began serious work with autistic

children and in 2000 committed to full-time work with

Autism Spectrum Disorders. He believes the

collaborative holistic approach is the most effective

way to solve chronic health problems and is committed

to doing everything possible to help solve your

child's problems.


Q: What do you suggest for kids having frequent

coughs and colds on TDDMPS?

We just reach one third of my child’s full dose.

Should we use Colostrum or Transfer Factor or anything

else? which would you suggest we start with?

Is a particular type recommended?


I am concerned as Colostrum also has growth factors

and my child (7 Year old)has some symptoms of

precocious puberty(pubic hair), will colostrum cause

more of such symptoms


A: We see great responses in some children with

colostrum and transfer factor; with other kids it

misses the mark. Transfer factor is quite safe but not

low cost. Colostrum is more reasonable, I haven’t seen

problems with it. Kirkman’s makes colostrums. I’ll go

up to 40 units a day with vitamin A (palmitate), up to

100 if child has a cold. Watch for dry skin, chapped

lips. Also make sure you get vitamin C per day; zinc.

Selenium is antiviral, can be used for colds. I like

Echinacea/astralugus – Kirkman’s has that. I also use

thymus extract a lot, 1 or 2 capsules. It’s

inexpensive, safe, well-tolerated. Beta-glucan is

helpful for some kids, except for the really

yeast-sensitive. Hydrochloric acid injection has

worked well. It’s infrequent that td-dmps stresses



Endocrine disruption – chlorine, PCBs, pesticides,

plastics, phthalates – hormonally disruptive. Early

puberty is happening more often. Eliminate plastics.

Avoid high-meat diet. Avoid pesticides.


Q: We are having problems with sleeping at our house.

My son has been taking .5 mg. of melatonin for a few

months now and it isn't working anymore. He sits up

in bed and refusing to fall asleep, until he falls

over with exhaustion. He is also getting up in the

night. I don't know what to do. He has been chelating

for about 6 months now on TD -DMSA and just added in

ALA. He takes MB-12 injections, various supplements,

GF/CF/ diet, TD-Glutathione, probiotics, and epsom

salt cream. It takes him at least 45 minutes to get

to sleep each night and he isn't falling to sleep

until around 10:30 p.m. He attends 2 nd grade and is 8

years old.


A: Sleep problems take a toll on everyone. It’s so

important to treat that symptom, and get behind what’s

causing it. Intolerance for enzymes, allergic

reactions, gluten exposures, reflux esophagitus,

hypoglycemia, yeast issues, pain, allergies, mold, all

contribute to sleep disorders.

½ milligram of melatonin, up to 3 mg. I’ve been

working with melatonin for years, no hormone

disruption. Night lights and lights in the bedroom

will disturb sleep.

Melatonin is a great help for antioxidant instruction.

We also use Gaba, trytophan, inositol, extra



Q: Dr Green, hi I was wondering if you feel that we

should be looking at EDTA to chelate out lead - as you

know, Dan's got elevated lead, and he's been on

TD-DMPS for months- and his EDTA challenge shows he's

still pulling lots of lead. Also, can you explain your

"triple approach" to chelation? Also, at what point

should we add ALA?



A: EDTA is a good remedy - Orally, rectally, not sure

about the transdermal. I’m still willing to do iv-edta

too, but we’re careful about who we do it with and the

circumstances, we use calcium edta. It’s not apt to

cause issues like the dmsa/dmps coming through the

gut. It’s slow to get out. Is your child tolerating

the chelator, are you seeing good response? That is

reason to continue. I like to use edta intermittently,

to see how he feels on and how he feels off.

The triple approach, transdermal oral and injected

(for dmps). We vary the approach, switch from oral, to

transdermal, to injected. We also use the ALA – it’s a

great anti-oxidant, don’t be afraid of the ALA except

for the yeast. I usually wait until the mercury is

down a little before adding ALA, just in case there is

redistribution. ALA, in an animal body, appears to be

curative, appears to get into the brain.


Q: I'm wondering how many of your patients are testing

positive for lyme and WA babisia? Have any of your

patients with ASD tested negatively at IGENEX? Do you

recommend antibiotics for these patients, what other

approaches have you tried? Is this something most

parents should check into?


A: A lot of the kids are testing positive for lyme.

Igenex - I have had a lot of negatives a couple

positives. I just tested myself, thought I had lyme

(I’m a deer hunter) and I had some symptoms. I did

Igenex. I’m taking it with a grain of salt, in terms

of where to go. If we had an easy antibiotic regimen,

I’d jump in. But I am selective about antibiotics for

kids. I’ve been able to control my achiness with

Echinacea, etc. If you live in an endemic area, make

decisions about intervention using alternative.

Vitamin C and saline. Full dose vit C will however

cause diarrhea. Transfer Factor from Chisholm(sp?)

Labs is lyme specific. Cats Claw is of some help.

Artemisia(sp?) is helpful. Intramuscular penicillin

not bad.


Q: We are using TD DMPS for our son. We are wondering

if there is any impact on us from inhaling it when we

apply it on our son?


A: What you’re smelling must have a few molecules of

dmps, but I can’t imagine any risk with inhaling it.

I’ve never heard of an anaphylactic risk from dmps

inhalation. I’ve heard of allergies to dmps.

If you don’t have amalgam fillings, you can use your

bare hands to apply. Then you will be chelating a

little too.

If you have fillings, be very careful.

If your husband gets headaches, he must be chemically

sensitive. Not dangerous, but he probably should stay



Q: Do most ASD kids have low adrenals? If a child has

low adrenals can it get in the way of other

interventions? What can be done?


A: I would do more testing if I could get more saliva.

It’s not only low adrenals we find – often we find

that they’re dumping a lot of cortisol. They don’t

store much cortisol, they don’t make much either, have

to have decent bile function in order to make it. Low

adrenal is part of the problem for many kids, tends to

be an aspect of hypoglycemia and allergies. Adrenal

cortex is a good gentle cortisol to take, often

helpful. It may help with energy. Vit C, manganese,

licorice root are all good helpers. We check most of

our kids for sodium and potassium – most are low on

potassium. Use light salt to get sodium down and

potassium up. Licorice root tea is a good support. No

more then a cup a day. Thorne makes a good adrenal



Q: Are you getting good pulls of mercury at the one

year point with TD DMPS? If yes, is it fecal or urine?

What age kids?


A: I haven’t heard anyone say they can get a

significant dump from td-dmps. We don’t see it in the

urine, the stool. Is it going out in the skin? It

certainly helps some children. I use IV or oral

challenges to get a read on the mercury. Mercury

generally goes down gradually with td-dmps, not as

fast as oral.


Q: My 8 yr. old son with tic syndrome had a blood

serum zinc level of 76. I started supplementing with

about 35 mg of zinc every other night. I had read

where white spots or lines on the fingernails could be

a sign of zinc deficiency. Since I started to

supplement the white spots on his nails have gotten so

much worse. My husband thought he actually had white

paint on his nails. Do you think there is a

connection? Do you see many kids with tics? Thanks!



A: I have white spots on my nails too. I take 120 mg

of zinc a day, that usually clears it up. It’s either

calcium or zinc deficiency. Some folks believe it’s

related to celiac and malabsorption, but that’s out of

the question. With a level of 76, he has a ways to go.

He might need twice that dose (35 x 2) daily.

Tics, yes I see quite a few kids with tics. High dose

krill (4-8 5 mg capsules a day) seems to clear it. I

like krill, nice delivery of essential fatty acids.

Also B1, magnesium help with tics.


Q: First, thank you, Dr. Green, for taking the time to

speak to us. I would like to start chelating

my 3 yr old son. Is it ok to chelate him while on a

regular multivitamin (in addition to other

supplements) or is a supplement like SuperNuThera

necessary? He is currently on the following

supplements: Magnesium Glycinate Powder; Calcium

Powder; DMG w/ folinic acid & b12; B3-Niacinmide; Cod

Liver Oil; Zinc Cream; MethylB12 shots; Enzyme

Complete DPP-IV; and a regular children's chewable

multivitamin. He used to take SuperNuThera but can't

tolerate the taste any more - and will not swallow

capsules without vomiting (as he is so orally

sensitive), therefore, I replaced that particular one

with the regular kids chewable multivitamin... is that

enough for chelation?


A: Yes, the td approach is gentle and sustainable; one

doesn’t have to be aggressive about mineral

replacement, at least getting started. I’m not a big

fan of zinc sulfate cream, I like liquid zinc during

chelation. You don’t have to use SuperNu Thera. Lots

of kids don’t tolerate B6, because of gut issues, etc.

Do keep an eye on minerals. When you do tests, get

nNutrient elements and toxic metals. Better to do the

test when you haven’t taken extra minerals that day.


Q: Hi Doc G....can you give me the "recipe" for mixing

and dosing K-III for potassium supplementing again?

(and dose) I have spaced it out (woops). Also , when

you do the minerals test along with chelation and

things like zinc and molybdenum are high, does this

mean they are getting too much?


A: I like K-III, it’s pharmaceutical level, we use ¼

tsp of powder once or twice a day, but test potassium

first. You’ll see other minerals moving after an iv,

molybdenum, copper, zinc, potassium, etc. The chelator

pulls out some of this. Depending on how much you get

24 hours before the test. We often tend to over

supplement those. We see selenium get too high when

kids get over 100 mg/day.


Q: Do you have any recommendations for fighting

stubborn eczema? We are GF/SF/CF/CnF etc... strictly

following her food sensitivities blood test.



A: Eczema is a big issue. For kids with eczema, do IgE

test. Virox cream by Biogenesis is touted as an eczema

remedy, I’ve had good results sometimes. Bioset and

acupuncture are helpful. LDA and allergy shots are



Q: What is your suggestion for boosting the immune

system after LDN and high Vitamin A protocols as well

as several natural immune boosters are used? What are

your thoughts on IVIG? My son is a candidate for IVIG

according to our DAN! and Immunologist. Insurance not

being an issue as they will cover the high costs if we

decide to go this route. We're still trying to make

the right decision for our son and appreciate your

opinion. I do want to say that my son is sleeping for

the first time ever since starting LDN.


A: If you have a child showing immune dysfunction,

consider zinc, thymus, astralagus, Echinacea, etc.

Boosting immune in a child with autoimmune issues is

not an easy matter. I’m a big fan of IVIG except for

the cost and the stress involved. There is no test to

predict if IVIG will work for your child, except you

must make certain he has enough iva(sp?), otherwise

don’t do the IVIG!

I’m glad LDN is working for you.

I would encourage you to do a trial of IVIG to see how

he tolerates. After 3 rounds or so you should know if

he tolerates.

Oxidative stress – make sure enough antioxidant

support and inflammatory support. Ginger,

ashwaganda(sp?), etc. are good for inflammation. Those

are immune-supportive.


Q: I have tourette syndrome. I'm using td-dmps, one

week on and one week off. I'm on my first week and am

only using 2 drops every 8 hours (starting low). 2

days after starting I had a black spec in my urine. 4

days after starting there were about 5 specs. No

one's heard of this happening before in urine. I’ve

never had this happen before starting tddmps. Could

it be metals? I had a sample checked for bacteria and

infections and those weren't a problem. I had a low

grade fever come on today. Is this normal with

tddmps? What's the normal zinc serum level?


A: Black specks are probably not metals. You can check

urine, but we haven’t seen metals coming out as black

specks in urine. 100 or 120 is the normal zinc serum.

Labs will say normal is 70-130. People may have

sensitivities to dmps. You can play around with higher

dose; or work up slowly.


Q: Hi Dr. Green. We are about to start the B12 shots

end of this week. What exactly is the B12 for and

what are we looking for? Also she has started school

in a newly constructed school. Teachers have told us

that the walls are made of a wheat product. Is this

something we should look into for exactly what it is,

or because it's in the wall not a concern? Thank you

for all your help, you and your staff are wonderful.


A: If she’s allergic to wheat, or has IgE allergy to

it, then the dust is a problem.

Get on Jim Neubrander’s site to read more about MB-12.

It’s one of the most beneficial and gentle remedies.

Make sure to use methyl.


Q: Hi Dr. Green What results are you seeing with LDN?

Does it have any side effects during chelation? We are

starting later this week and are two months into

chelating. Also - I've always wondered, how far back

can our kids come? Prognostically speaking, how do you

gauge expected outcomes? Have you seen any/many come

all the way back ? Have always wanted to ask. Our son

is making amazing progress (in your care) but we want

to temper our hopes and our family's.


A: I have no fear of using LDN, not during chelation

or anything else. If you’re doing too many things at

once, it’s hard to tell what’s doing what. Often, LDN

starts out negative, and turns around to positive. Dr

McCandless’ work with this is so beneficial. We hope

it will help with the inflamed bowel and Crohn’s. I

haven’t seen as much benefit as Dr McC, but moodwise

it seems to help.

I’ve seen a lot of young non-verbal kids make great

gains, get language back, so age is an important

factor. Harder with a non-verbal 8 year old.


Q: Can TD-DMPS be harmful for kids with chemical

sensitivities? What about other chelators? Also, my

son headbangs a lot. While I know this can be caused

by gut pain, for my son it is head pain becuz he wants

us to rub his head. Whenever my son starts to get

better socially he headbangs more. Why would this be

and can I do anything?


A: Giving dmps to adults with chemical sensitivities,

it has been poorly tolerated. A lot of them are

mercury-toxic. I expect a little better tolerance for

edta then the sulphur-y chelators. I agree,

head-banging is a sign of head pain, migraine or

something. Vascular headaches. Some of the migraine

remedies, like Feverfew, can be helpful. We might give

ibuprofen, to see if there is good evidence there is a

head ache. Suppressing the behavior is not smart if he

really is telling you he has pain.


Q: How do you feel about IV Glutathione? Would weekly

IV's help GI function? Also, would it help to chelate

a child? Thanks so much!


A: I would do it for every kid as a trial, if I could.

Some kids are too far away. We try to boost NAC, or

other things, if they’re too far away. I don’t see it

as a chelator, supports metallathionein, helps to

clear out intracellular toxins. Could help GI



Q: 1) What is protocol do you recommend for the FIR

Sauna? 2) What other "natural chelators" do you

recommend, ie Metal Free, NDF+, Clay baths, Foot bath,

etc. 3) What about the metals bound to the natural

chelators - ie cilantro? Do you ascribe to the notion

that the mercury is so tightly bound to those

substances that it will just go in and out?


A: I don’t have a protocol for FIR-as long as the

child can handle. Start low, 100 or 105 degrees, for

few minutes, work your way up.

MetalFree is unimpressive. Clay and foot bath are

harmless, but I haven’t seen big value. I have had

good feedback on NDF. I worry about cilantro, because

it grows, rain falls, rain has mercury. Chlorella too,

I worry about. Joe Mercola swears he has a brand that

is clean, no mercury (www.mercola.com).

I don’t know the answer on the mercury being tightly

bound, need more studies.


Q: For the kids like my son who seem to be non

responders/gut kids, is there any new treatments or

studies that are going to talked about at the next

DAN! that may be of some help?



A: This is what the think tanks are for. Children who

are non-responders – you need to keep expanding your

range of possibilities and testing.


Q: does 'n phenol' help with phenol

intolerance..thanks dr green..


A: It helps more often then you think. Has helped with

responsiveness of the kids. Coconut oil also has the

potential to help.


Q: We have always had hearing sensitivities. Done AIT

3 times. We are doing TD DMPS. We give zinc picolinate

at body weight plus 20 mgs. Double on off days. What

do you think about zinc monomethionine? Which is

absorbed better?


A: I don’t think the different types of zinc make that

much of a difference. Magnesium is at least as

important. What about doing a trial of acupuncture?

More work on the essential fatty acids, up to 2000 or

3000 EPA; or the krill oil, 3-6 capsules.GABA,

inositol, l-theanine, 5HTP; can all help settle.

The older girls, 10, 11, 12, before puberty,

progesterone support like td-progesterone can be

helpful. That’s relatively ok for anyone (male or

female), in low doses


Q: Have you ever seen a child react negatively to

magnesium cream? My 4 year old Aspergers son said

today his bone hurt where I put the cream. When I used

it on him the 1st time the knuckles of that hand



A: No I’ve never seen a child react with pain to

magnesium cream. Maybe the other ingredients? I am a

bigger fan of Epsom salts. He might be sensitive to

magnesium sulfate, try dissolving it in the bathtub.

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Hilary's biochat notes


Rudi Verspoor FHCH, HD(RHom.), DMH

Rudi Verspoor has been studying Hahnemann's medical

system for more than two decades and has acquired

extensive clinical experience, particularly relating

to complex and chronic cases, in the application of

this system. His abiding interest in history and

philosophy has led him to undertake continual research

into various problems and issues that have arisen in

traditional homeopathic treatment. This research has

led to the development of a systematic dynamic

approach to therapeutics that is now being offered in

a comprehensive form to others through a five-year



Patty Smith FHCH, DVHH, HD(RHom.), DMH, BScEd

Patty worked with Rudi Verspoor on Homeopathy Renewed,

and she has contributed many articles to newspapers,

and wholistic and homeopathic journals and magazines

in the United States and Canada. She is currently

editor of the Heilkunst Journal, a publication of the

Hahnemann Center for Heilkunst; Resonance, the

newsletter of the Hahnemann College; as well as News

and Views, the newsletter of the Hahnemann Clinic. She

currently is working on A Patient's Guide to Heilkunst

and A Patient's Guide to Vaccinations, and Homeo- and



(sorry, no Q&A tonight, I couldn’t write and talk at

the same time, so here’s what I jotted down)


• As far as supplements, they believe in whole food

supplements. They like the body ecology diet. Some

products they mentioned: juice plus, Nordic Natural

cod liver oil, Ande bars, Living Fuel


• Their website is www.heilkunst.com and

practictioners can be found at

www.heilkunst.com/directory . To write Patty,

patty@homeopathy.com (patty at homeopathy dot com).

• They wrote a book, available from Amazon, called

Autism: The Journey Back.

• They’ve seen good results from using potentized

vitamin B-12 (as opposed to doing the shots)

• They do feel bioplasma (12 essential cell salts) is

important. They also mentioned celtic sea salts, green

foods and super foods with enzymes, and chlorophyll

(as a good source of magnesium).

• Vitamin C is one of the greatest and cheapest


• Homeopathy and Heilkunst can work along with the

DAN! protocol. (Homeopathy will not interfere with

DAN!, but DAN! might interfere with homeopathy.)

• They can treat pretty much any issue, from autism

spectrum disorders to motor disorders to lack of eye

contact to focus to gut issues, etc. with Heilkunst.

• Average monthly cost is $90 for a ½ hour followup

which includes a remedy/energy medicine. They

recommend supplements that you can purchase outside

that price. The initial consultation is slightly


• They’re in Ottawa, Canada, but they do work long

distance by phone and email.

• They offer courses in Heilkunst, as well as a short

course called Homeopathy at Home (see their website

www.heilkunst.com ) You get an online tutor, and work

by email and teleconference. There’s also an online

study group.


ps My novice understanding of Heilkunst is homeopathy

plus supplementation/nutrition.

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Tonight on the live chat accessible from Dr. Neubrander's site-

www.drneubrander.com--we will have guest speaker Susan Owens. See

the information below and please come join us!!



Tuesday October 4, 9:00pm EST





Since completing her masters degree at the University of Texas in

Dallas, Mrs. Owens has lectured widely in the U.S, including the

Center for Disease Control and the National Institute of Health in

Bethesda. She has also lectured as far afield as Scotland, England,

Australia, and Norway. She brings into her lectures information she

has gained from ten years of interacting with parents and doctors of

children with autism while she maintained an intense study of the

medical literature, including literature that we need to understand

today's issues, but which got lost in earlier decades. This effort

has been directed mainly at finding the basic science that can tell

us how the sulfur system works: how it is integrated, how it matures,

and how it interacts with other systems. Oxalates appear to be part

of that system, but their role outside the role of binding to calcium

and incidentally forming kidney stones, is little understood.


As a member of the Defeat Autism Now! Thinktank (a project of the

Autism Research Instiute), she continually dialogues with physicians

and scientists who treat children with autism. She also consults with

sulfur scientists and other basic scientists who are on the cutting

edges of their fields, attempting to recruit them into studying

autism, but also attempting to cross-pollinate information that

generally stays behind disciplinary barriers. She does extensive

analysis of labwork, specializing in studying ratios and their

meaning in the plasma amino acid tests and studying correlations

within other tests. By comparing the findings and reference ranges

from labs all over the US and world on different tests, she has

developed some concerns about the suitability of how reference ranges

are calculated for urinary tests on young children. She is working

actively at getting some policy changes in place to assure more

accurate testing for this age group. Two years ago, in order to gain

from the experience of those outside autism circles, she began an

internet list where people discuss successes and failures they have

had with sulfur-related supplements at sulfurstories@yahoogroups.com.

It now has over 720 members. She recently opened a new group called

Trying_Low_Oxalates, with 170 members, currently, where people can

learn how to implement a low oxalate diet. She is delighted to be

here to talk about the amazing improvements children are experiencing

on the low oxalate diet.


*My plans for this evening have just changed-kim

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Hilary Downing from ASD_Solutions- Biochat Notes

Speaker Susan Owens


Q: Can you tell us what oxalates are, and the basics

of the diet?


A: Oxalates are two carbons joined together with 4

oxygens. It’s a structure similar to sulfur. There are

a lot of problems with sulfate chemistry in autism, so

it’s interesting that the oxalate structure is so

similar. Dr. Rimland did some studies (16-18) that

showed B6 was affected in autism. B6 is key for the

sulfur chemistry, and for oxalates.

When you have inflamed gut, Crohn’s for example, very

few oxalates are absorbed. So since autistic kids

often have inflamed gut, it made sense to have a

low-oxalate diet. We did a pilot study with 7 kids.

All 7 were high in oxalates, and started the diet.

They had problems with frequent urination, GI pain,

etc. within a couple hours of eating. They had changes

in behavior following eating. Things started changing

with the diet. A lot of the things we’ve been calling

yeasty behaviors go away with a low-oxalate diet. A

lot of these kids had trouble taking DMG and TMG,

glycine in general. We saw problems with

constipation/diarrhea in these kids before the diet,

even after being treated by GI docs. A lot of these

children had trouble when introducing nuts, legumes,

soy. A lot of these kids craved high-oxalate foods.


Q: What foods are high in oxalates?


A: Nuts, legumes, green leafy vegetables, spinach,

chard, black raspberry, soy, pecans, refried beans,

almond, beet, okra, sweet potatoes, chocolate, cocoa,

a lot of different teas, black current, dried fig,

canned fruit salad, concord grapes, rubarb, tamarillo,

tapioca are all extremely high in oxalates. If you

google ‘oxalate contents of food’ you should find all

the details of high-oxalate and medium-oxalate foods.

It makes sense to try low-oxalate diet for at least a

week before moving to medium-oxalates.


Q: My son only eats PB&J, sugary juice, pretzels,

milk, and chocolate. I have tried to limit his diet,

but he refuses to eat longer than I can hold out. Any

ideas on how to get him off this diet without



A: Some of the food preferences of these kids are

changing on the diet. Rice/corn caused one child to

break out – now that she’s on a low-oxalate diet,

those same foods aren’t making her break out anymore.

Chocolate and peanut butter are high in oxalates,

jelly might be too. Milk is generally ok, but soy milk

is extremely high in oxalate.

Oxalates are very easily produced by sugar. If you eat

a lot of sugar, it depresses thiamine chemistry.

Enzymes then turn things into oxalates. So don’t eat a

lot of sugar.


Q: My son is SCD legal, but still does not have a

healthy appetite. Do you have any advice on how I can

increase his appetite?


A: Is he trying a low-oxalate diet yet? (no, just scd,

no juice, lots of proteins). There are children that

are eating an awful lot of food, and not putting on

weight, and they act starved all the time. When on a

low-oxalate diet, they stopped acting starved, gained

weight and height. I went on the low-oxalate diet

myself a few months ago. I found that foods taste

better now. Oxalates deplete glutathione in a big way.

Oxalates may be changing the trafficking of zinc.

Oxalates and inflammation seem to go hand in hand,

more research needs to be done on oxalates and

inflammation. Oxalates induce oxidative stress and

reduce glutathione, could possibly affect TH1 to TH2



Q: Hi Susan, thanks for taking my question. Do you

recommend doing a low oxalate diet with a gfcf diet?

What is your web site?


A: I think when you start the diet, it’s a good idea

to keep in place what you are already doing, and see

if getting off the oxalates changes your sensitivity

to certain things. Some folks who couldn’t tolerate

rice or corn can now tolerate. Another person has

reintroduced gluten and casein, and is doing well.

You can sign up to the yahoo group

Trying_Low_Oxalates. You can sign up as “no email” and

not be overwhelmed by the mail.



Q: Would you discuss B vitamins and oxalate

chemistry...We are SCD but I have been reading LOD

yahoo board and caught bits and pieces of discussion

regarding thiamine and biotin. I am interested

because I am unable to get my son on B vitamins

without alot of hyperactivity.


A: The rules about intolerances to different

supplements are changing. Zinc is depleted with

oxalate. A lot of kids have been on very high zinc.

Now they’re reducing their zinc on the low-oxalate

diet. The parents trying this diet move low and slow

(low dose, go slow with changes).


Q: Might the oxalate issue be more important than GFCF

issues for some kids? Do kids who respond to GFCF

tend to be the same ones who respond to this diet? Are

oxalates related to metals at all?


A: Gluten is metabolized towards oxalates. Casein is

not a problem – but lactose might be, because that can

be metabolized towards oxalates. Oxalates are related

to metals – they are very potent in their chelating

abilities. Not sure how this relates to DMSA or DMPS,

but ALA seems to reduce oxalates. So while we might

have thought it was a great chelator, perhaps the

effect we’re seeing is from the reduction of oxalates.

ALA is anti-oxalate, noone has ever thought to test

the other chelating agents to see if they are.



Q: We've been LOD for about 1 month. I tried it

because my son urinates constantly. However, I haven't

adjusted supplements. Are there supplements that we

should avoid? We are starting td-ALA soon.


A: The ALA should help. There are quite a few

supplements that are helpful. Taurine is anti-oxalate,

give more taurine.

Oxalates bind beta-alanine. If your son is urinating

constantly, this diet might very well help.


Q: Hi. My son had an allergic reaction after 12 weeks

to the DMPS. We are now using DMSA. I am worried he

may have reacted to the sulfur. DO you think the low

oxalate diet could help him not react to sulfur?


A: I do think there is a possibility that some of the

kids with sulfur-sensitivity could be the oxalate

kids. A few parents reported that on the diet they

were seeing sulfur-sensitivity diminish. Children

eating swiss chard and spinach every other day don’t

see the differences from day to day – it may be

because their bodies have so many oxalates, they’re

not seeing the difference.


Q: My daughter is taking custom amino acids after

being tested through Metametrix. She was quite low in

her profile across the board. Do you have experience

with these types of products? I don't know if it is



A: I’ve been looking at the reference ranges on

urinary tests. The creatinine doesn’t seem stable

enough. Also the reference ranges are based on adults,

and the kids doing these tests are 2 and 3. Write me

off list.


Q: What are some indicators that LOD might help a

child...you have said problem with sulfur supplements,

urinary issues, what else?


A: Issues in speech (that’s the area we see improve

the quickest); a lot of yeasty behaviors; if you’ve

been on a lot of antibiotics.


Q: Can you tell us more about your work as a thinktank

member? What is that like? How do the members get

together to share ideas?


A: It’s been fabulous. There are a lot of totally

dedicated people in the think tank. The doctors

compare notes, compare success stories, listen to how

other doctors solved problems for their patients, etc.

We’re getting past our growing pains, and really

accomplishing a lot. The internet really helps, and

the working relationship between doctors and parents.


Q: I give my son 1 peeled pear and several peeled

apples/ day - do you know if oxalate levels are lower

without the peels? It seems like some lists are

conflicting. Also, I've heard that food high in

phosphate (such as peas i think) may also cause

problem. What would indicate that?

A: There may be issues with phosphate with some kids,

I haven’t looked at it very closely. Even different

varieties of the same type of fruit/vegetable will

have different oxalate content. Kiwi fruit has 100+

varieties. The oxalates vary greatly between each

variety. It may also vary depending on the soil it was

grown in. Some foods are always high; others vary.


Q: How long is it taking for kids to respond to the

diet? Are any kids reacting badly to the diet? What

is the difference between oxalates and "oxidants"?


A: Astonishingly some kids show improvements in just a

day or two. Occasionally a child will start and have

worse behavior. If you’ve been really high oxalate and

you remove them, oxalates get trafficked to the gut

and cause really high oxalates there. We’ve been

experiencing with calcium citrate and magnesium

citrate, which are both anti-oxalate. The calcium is

important in the gut – if there is calcium in the gut,

the oxalates won’t be reabsorbed in the body, they’ll

stay in the stool.

Oxalates are oxidants. And oxidant creates oxidative

stress. Molecules that are not supposed to be bound

together get bound together during oxidative stress.

Proteins work differently when under oxidative stress.


Q: Do you know of any thing that may become an

"enzyme" or "helper" for oxalates? Like Petizyde helps

with cross contamination gluten...

Also, what about IP6 - that helps break apart kidney



A: We have to rely on our bacteria – it breaks

oxalates apart. There is a company trying to make a

probiotic, but it is about a year out. The enzymes

available are not what we need to break oxalates.

Acidophilus is an oxalate eating species, but if you

get too much oxalate it kills off acidophilus.

I’m not familiar with IP6.


Q: I have heard the NAC is helpful in detoxing poisons

such as mercury (not a chelator but aids in ridding

the body of these chemicals) My daughters doctor said

there are too many negative side effects but I

recently realized that she takes NAC 100mg a day in

her D-Hist supplement for allergies. She seems fine

should I look into giving her more NAC since it seems

that she is tolerating it with the D-Hist? Also is LDN

something that is helpful? My daughter is 6 and

non-verbal autistic.


A: We have had folks doing both LDN and low-oxalate

diet. One of our parents had such good results on

low-oxalate that she stopped LDN. It may be they’re

working on a similar system, it’s too early to know.

The one consistent thing in autism is that sulfur is

below the reference range. We need to explore the role

of oxalates.


Q: On the diet, is the ultimate goal to do LO foods

and then you may have a certain percentage of MO

foods that child tolerates and never high oxalate?


A: We’re trying to let the children tell us. We know

oxalates are a problem, but from child to child there

are different levels of absorption and other differing

factors. We do know that the kids that stick to

low-oxalate foods are doing very well.


Q: Do you know if whey is high or low oxalate and if

it can help with oxalates? Also, you mentioned using

calcium and magnesium citrate at first. Should the

child get regular doses or megadoses?


A: We’re learning about the cal and mag citrate. Start

low and slow. There was one child that started having

worse seizures after the cal citrate, but overall she

had less seizures on the low-oxalate diet. It seems

the kids do better to be on the diet several weeks,

then start the cal citrate. If you start the

low-oxalate diet and see behavior issues, you might

want to try low dose cal citrate.


Q: You mentioned issues with speech. Have you had

non-verbal children begin talking on the diet?


A: We haven’t had someone non-verbal try it yet. We

had a child who could speak a few words, and a week

into the diet was talking in 4-word sentences and

making good eye contact.


Q: Can you talk a little more about children who have

problem digesting fats and oxalates?


A: The idea of taking calcium in the meal is to bind

the oxalate so it’s not absorbed.

The bound calcium in spinach is not a problem, it’s

the free oxalate that is a problem so take calcium

with it. Even better, leave out the foods with high

oxalate altogether.


Q: 1) what might help with dyspraxia and motor

planning? 2) how are people deciding what might be low

oxalate if there isn't a test on that food?


A: We have a scientist willing to test foods that are

common in the autism community. You can list the food

that you want tested on the yahoo group website, and

he will test.

We have had children improving in motor skills. We

totally did not expect that gain. One of the children

went to see his grandparents, and they were astonished

at his motor skill improvements, and all his


Scientists have shown there are oxalates in the brain.

There are probably certain areas of the brain that are

more vulnerable. The autistic kids might have areas of

the brain influenced by oxalates.

If your oxalates are higher outside the cell, you

might be dragging sulfates out of the cell. These are

the areas you would expect to see more functional


Hippocampus and cerebellum are two areas that are

problem areas in autism…and have high oxalates.


Q: Are pumpkin seeds particularly good for oxalates?

Are oxalates related to autoimmune?


A: Most seeds are a problem with high oxalate, but for

some reason pumpkin seeds are not. Some of our moms

grind up pumpkin seeds to make flour.

Autoimmunity relates to the body making antibodies to

bind things that the body will get rid of. If you have

an injury, the body makes antibodies to do a clean up.

In autoimmunity, something keeps the reaction going,

the clean up keeps going.

It could be that a lot of these processes could be cut

back if we reduce oxalates.


Q: Would a GRADUAL transfer to LOD possibly avoid the

potential release of oxalates from the tissues in to

the gut that causes initial worsening of symptoms.


A: I don’t know, it’s kind of a tradeoff. Like

chelation, some folks go slower then others.


Q: My son had a urinalysis which showed urine cloudy,

crystals-present and _morph Ur 4+ is any of this

significant-he's 8 yrs. old.


A: It could be calcium oxalate. There are a lot of

internet sites where you can look up, but calcium

oxalate is one of the major ones. Certain crystals

will dissolve certain substances added to them. If you

refrigerate urine and it gets cloudy, it’s probably

crystallizing something.


Q: Can you talk more about how the cerebellum is

affected? My son has mild hyperplasia of the

cerebellar vermis so I am interested


A: The cerebellum is a modulator of info for the rest

of the brain, a traffic cop. You can actually get by

without one (a cerebellum), but if the one you have

isn’t working right, it can really mess you up.

One of our best responders did really well for a

month, then had a bad diaper and terrible behavior one

day. Afterwards he said his words were stuck. Maybe

the reason some of these kids aren’t talking is not

that they don’t have language, they just can’t get it



Q: Susan, thank you so much for your work in this

area. We think we're seeing the light at the end of

the tunnel for GI pain in our daughter! Will this be

a topic at the next DAN! ?


A: The oxalates will be mentioned by Maureen McDonald,

and Jacquelyn McCandless, but it will not be a feature

this time at DAN! The first tests were in June, and

the conferences are planned well in advance, so this

is a little too new. I am going to do a session, there

will be a room set aside to talk about issues that are

not part of the main conf. I’ll be in that room.


Q: Have kids who were not able to tolerate TMG before

the diet able to tolerate after?


A: I don’t know that we’ve had anybody that happened

to, I don’t recall anyone saying that. If excess

glycine was causing a backup, that might not be

addressed by the diet. Some kids have GI issues and

inflammation; they are absorbing more oxalates from

their diet. Some kids have weaknesses in pathways;

they might be producing more oxalates. This will take

a lot of sorting out.

I’m not satisfied with current testing either, so we

need to recruit scientists, laboratories. There is

also work needed to characterize enzymes that were

studied in the 50’s and 60’s. The research is so old,

the studies need to be redone. This will take

fundraising and serious organizational push.

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  • 1 month later...

Hilary from Chelating Kids Biochat Notes


Dr. James Neubrander


He will be discussing his new High Dose Daily protocol

presented at the LA DAN! conference. Also, how to

"Tweak" MB12 to make it more effective, and the

corollary to this "Why Is This Not Working". and

thoughts from the Long Beach DAN! Conference.


Q: We have been doing biomed with my 7 year old. Asd

son for 3 years now.

Nutritional- maintaining perfect gut, proper diet and

supplement regimen.

Chelation- 36 rounds - continuing "gains with every



My son has been doing your Mb-12 protocol for over

one year now. Lots of "wows" in the beginning, mostly

language and eye contact. Still some good stuff.

Spontaneous and social.

Every 3 days works best/ every day too much.


My Questions are about the Methylation cycle .

Do you feel there is a point when it will correct

itself? And How do you know when?

When do you decide if Mb12 is no longer appropriate?

Also does Folinic Acid aid in the process also what

about DMG?


A: MB-12 is a process. At first it’s like going to

school to start 1st grade, you start learning things

fast, you can see it. It’s the groundwork; we need it

like food, air and water. Then patients start adding

things, some things block it, other things aide it.

Over time, the stuff is still working, but you can’t

tell as much. Enzymes can possibly correct themselves.

There is a theory that a binding domain is not

present. If the 3rd binding domain is not present they

will not be able to recharge the b-12. If that’s a

genetic defect, we’re not sure if it will

self-correct. Three-year patients are better then

two-year are better then one-year, so right now I’m

thinking you don’t have to quit. Folinic acid is

really unrelated to mb-12 – they’re both involved in

the methylation pathway. Like hand and glove, they go

together, but do different things. DMG breaks down,

the pre-methylated folic member works with MTHFR to

become methylated folic acid. If you’re giving enough

mb-12, you probably don’t need DMG. DMG does help with

speech and language, goes to creatine.


Q: What is the proper dosage for MB12 for a 42lb 3year

old child? Also, I have him on every 3 days now for 6

months now. I want to do a trial of every 2 days. Do

I do the trial for 6 weeks before I know if it is

working better that way, or will I know sooner?


A: 25 mg/ml for a 42lb child at .05cc. For my

patients, I don’t them make major changes. Putting

kids on mb-12 is easy, taking them off is hard. I

would want to know there weren’t other things blocking

the mb-12, like TMG or high dose folinic acid. I would

want to make sure that the 3rd day is really a

plateau. I might go to daily rather then every 2nd day

if I was to make a change. I know if I have a

responder within 4 weeks.


Q: What I'm asking what can we expect to see happen

when we start with Dr. N., knowing that previous

treatments (supplements, enzymes, NAET, energy

treatments, etc.) haven't seemed to help.


A: I don’t know, but we will work on it together. When

people come to see us, we create an opens list, where

you’ve been, what you’ve done. That’s our approach. I

don’t know why it works, but I love my results.


Q: Have two children on MB12 since May – every other

day. 14 yr. old daughter has been having dry palms-

12 yr old son is taking his ear lobes (both) and

folding them up to is head and pressing - he is in

pain-have checked his ears they are fine. Are these

due to the MB 12?


A: I don’t know. If you’re my patient, ask me when you

come to see me. If you’re not my patient, I don’t know

what else you’re doing with it. I also don’t do every

other day. If you are seeing things sometimes, not

always, it’s probably not the mb-12.


Q: My son's urine appears a bit of reddish after the

shot, would that be indicating the shot is not given

correctly? (we definitely follows the instruction

precisely but still have that redness)


A: If a child is really thin, you can’t get shallow

enough to get in the subcutaneous tissue. Red urine

means the shot is in muscle. Speed of injection might

be too fast. Or the child is too thin.


Q: Hi Dr. Neubrander, My son is 3 1/2. He is non

verbal and we have been doing biomedical intervention

since. Jan. So far, we are seeing no results. We have

been doing the MB12 for about 4 months (every 3

days)and no results with that either. We added the

folinic acid right away, we did not wait. We are also

using TMG. Any advice to get better results? I am sure

I am injecting it at the correct angle. His yeast

issues have gotten worse also, could that be from the

MB12?Thank you


A: TMG is against my religion. Too many of my kids do

not get the mb-12 benefit until we take the TMG away.

Two enzyme systems competing with each other.

If the parent uses my parent-designed report, we find

things that aren’t easy to see. You have to understand

what it out there and what the mb-12 responses are.

Use the parent-designed report form, hold yourself

accountable, write every six weeks, and you’ll be

surprised what you see happening. Otherwise you might

not see that this is really working. MB-12 doesn’t

directly increase yeast issues. I can think of ways

that it might indirectly increase yeast. Anybody can

get my dose range online. It’s important to make mb-12

work. Supplement review program is on Dr Neubrander’s

download page.


Q: My son's MMA is not coming down with MB12

injections (over a year). Talk about the use of a

mixture of adenosyl- and methyl-. Will this bring the

MMA into range and will I see more progress when the

adenosyl is added? I did see an initial response

(mostly energy--much needed) with the MB12 alone. I

am injecting according to your specifications.


A: MMA is not related to mb-12. MMA is a problem when

you don’t have enough adenosyl b-12. I use adenosyl

b-12 very cautiously, only in those with MMA problem.

MMA is not going to come down with mb-12. Use the

parent-designed report, otherwise you won’t be able to

see the mb-12 progress.


Q: 3+yo, mB12 every 3 days for 7 months, 800mcg/day

folinic, no TMG. No changes noticed. Keep going?

I.e., have you seen kids with not much for that long,

then improvement?


A: Mb-12, if the child is a responder, might be needed

forever. But the only way to know if a responder is

use the parent-designed report. If you don’t know what

mb-12 does, you’re going to miss the “little green

hair and freckles” thing.

When you come in and start mb-12, it’s like planting a

seedling to watch it grow.

6% of my kids I can’t get to “grow”, in other words

they’re not responders. But the other 94% I come back

and say I don’t know if your child will be a bush, a

pine tree, or a redwood. Everyone wants a redwood, but

a bush is still better then grass.


There are a lot of other supplements that are needed

to make this all work. And there are some supplements

to avoid because they get in the way, DMG, TMG. Stay

off dairy.


Q: My son is 9 years old. We have been giving MB12

for 1 month with positive changes. It seems I hit a

little muscle every time because my son's urine is a

light pink. I have changed location and angle but it

is still a little pink just after each shot. Is this

common? Should I be concerned about the impact to the

kidneys, short term or long term? Also, we do every 3

days, and by day 2.5 we see it wear off. Should

we/could we do every 2 days? Why does it wear off and

we see regression in language (spontaneous),

concentration and calmness? Thanks.


A: We need to get the shot into the fat, if at all

possible. Any time you get it in muscle, it’s

immediately starting to go out of your body. The lower

the surface area, the slower it comes out. If you take

two 5 gallon buckets of water to a tennis court in

Death Valley, the bucket you throw over the court will

evaporate very quickly, the other in the bucket will

be there a day or two later. Any time the shot goes

into muscle, it’s in the blood, the kidney starts

clearing that in minutes. MB-12 doesn’t hurt the

kidney at all. But if you’re getting it in the muscle,

you’re not getting the build effect. When you get the

fat, it’s a slow leaching effect, all the time, and it

does wear off after 2.5 days.



HDD – High Dose Daily


It’s very important for me to know who is and who

isn’t a responder. I don’t care what you’re on when

you come to me, as long as you don’t change anything

biomedically during the 5 weeks when we start mb-12.

That means don’t start anything new, don’t stop

anything old. After the 5 weeks, fill out the

parent-designed report form, and we see if the child

is a responder. That’s the Y-axis. I’m looking for a

change in the rate of improvement of your child.

Things will be inconsistent at first. MB-12 opens up a

pathway, so learning will start kicking in. Most

important is for one or two 6-week cycles, so I can

tell the slope. Just adding more mb-12 is not

necessarily better, only about 40% of kids do better

with a higher dose and increased frequency. I don’t do

a HDD until I have patients on my supplement ranges.

They might be higher then what other doctors use, but

those are my numbers.

Then I go to the next stage, and test High Dose Daily.

It’s the same dose and volume, but I switch to every

day. Then patients need to come back and talk about

undeniable change. Not like ‘his eyesight might be a

little better’. It has to be undeniable. In the 40%

that do better with HDD, they will pick up more things

they never had before with the every 3-day protocol.

One of the things I see higher-then-expected are

parents talking about socialization and expressive

language with HDD.

When we try to take HDD away from a patient that sees

“his eyesight might be a little better”, the patient

might then see that it clearly was a gain. I have a

way that I stop the HDD for a certain percentage of


People sometimes want too much too soon. More, bigger,

better, longer, stronger. But more is not necessarily

better. If I put in more then the child needs, that is

something that the child’s body then has to get rid


In my practice, again, it’s about 40% that see the

benefit, so don’t just take more because you think

more is better.

I do get more side-effects with HDD. If they are the

tolerable side effects, they might leave after 4 to 6

months. There is more chance for intolerable side

effects. If the side effects are intolerable, stop for

a day or two, then move back to the once every three

day protocol. The main thing is to let the mb-12 grow.

We have big things in my practice: MB-12, the diet,

the GI issues that Dr Krigsman takes care of,

chelation, HBOT, supplements – those are my major

players. I love what I do, it works, I have a very

sane way of doing this. I have a PA that is really

sharp and a nurse practitioner that is really sharp.





Q: Hi Dr. Neubrander thank you for your time this

evening and all your work on behalf of our children.

My question is can a zinc deficiency have a

significant impact on the effectiveness of MB12? What

amount do you recommend for a 50 pound chelating child

and do you have a type you prefer?


A: Absolutely. Zinc is necessary to take adenosine off

of adenosylhomocysteine. Typically for a chelating

child, 70 or 75 for zinc, the child’s weight plus 15

or 20. Sometimes if zinc deficient I’ll give them

double their weight. I monitor this.


Q: Hi, what are your thoughts on DMAE for non m-b12

responders? Also, my son's test results just showed

clostridia, how do you recommend treating this?


A: I’m not sure your child is an mb-12 responder

unless I do it and you use the parent-designed form.

DMAE is not a major player in my game. Clostridia –

flagyl can help. Start with the herbals, less

expensive and more tolerated. If those don’t work try

flagyl, vancomycin.


Q: Hi Dr.Neubrander, 1) similar to mouthing

side-effect with MB12, could similar symptoms like

tingling sensitivity at the tips of the fingers/ arms

be caused because of MB12? If so, do we expect it to

go away within a few months? Also, is it a positive

negative? 2) Who is a good candidate for HDD? 3) Is

DMPS-IV as a chelator (not just as provoking

agent)safe for a 6yr-47lb boy who didn't do well with

DMSA-oral-yeast issues?


A: there are 5 b-12s, cyano, hydroxyl, glutathionyl,

adenosyl, and methyl. The cobalamin heals nerves. You

first feel tingling around your tongue, lips, mouth,

because it’s the shortest peripheral nerve. Then

hands, then feet and legs. That’s perfectly normal,

and that’s a positive negative.

Anybody who has been playing the game and knows that

they plateaued and are using all the supplements, they

are a good candidate for HDD.

I believe in DMPS-IV, but has to be done safely, done

right. DMSA oral does cause yeast issues. Nothing

works as well as iv, but it’s expensive, invasive,



Q: I have a question about adding NDF+ to my

daughter's chelation(TD-DMPS). Do we have to

stop/reduce Probiotics? What are other do's and


A: We allow NDF if you want it, the NDF people have

their protocol, and they see good things.


Q: Hi Dr. Neubrander, I'm Aidan. I'm 7 and have been

on MB-12 for one year now. One day I'm so grumpy and

want to hit someone (Mom says that's day 3) and

another day I feel so much better it's like the sun

brightened me. I think it's the MB-12 that makes the

days good. How can I get more bright days and fewer

grumpy days? I weigh 48 pounds and my dose every

three days is 1750mcg or .07 cc. I don't take TMG,

but use TD-GSH, folinic and LOTS of supplements. My

diet is low polysaccharide, gfcfsf. Thanks for helping



A: You might try daily, or every other day, if you see

it’s wearing off. That doesn’t mean you need

more/higher dose. Just a greater frequency. You’re not

doing anything wrong, but there are a lot of other

things to add to your program. That’s a great start.


Q: Dr. Neubrander what's your opinion re using MB12

shot and TD-DMPS together. We're on mb12 shot for 6

weeks and now our doctor adds in td-dmps. How do think

of that?


A: I like it, not a problem. One of the purposes of

mb-12 is to increase glutathione. If you don’t have

the glutathione, you can’t get rid of the heavy

metals. You need the glutathione, so I always prime my

people with mb-12 before chelation.


Q: How would you recommend adding DMG with a child

already on MB-12 with moderate results but still no

speech. At 61 lbs and 6 years old what is the

recommended dosage of MB12 and DMG? Is Kirkman DMG

with folinic acid what you would recommend? Our

dosage of MB12 is 25mg / 0.07ml


A: That’s a fine dose, it sounds close, and Kirkman’s

is fine. But I would first try more mb-12. I don’t

think it’s a DMG issue, as much as an underdosing of

mb-12. The mb-12 needs to get in for speech and

language, to create creatine.


Q: Lots of talk about HBOT recently. When is the best

time to try this-before, during or after chelation?

How many dives are needed? Any indicator as to who

will be a responder to this?


A: You’ll hear different people say different things.

In our practice we won’t say whether you need to do

HBOT before during or after. If you want to do it, get

here. I’m pretty convinced that we’ll use it any time

you want to get in the chamber. It’s a great thing.

There are very few things I’ve been this excited



Q: Hey there Dr. N, my question for the evening is my

2 and a half year old 33 lbs son has a mutant MTHFR

gene, what would you recommend? Also his hair test

showed very high aluminum, our td dmps challange

showed up with nothing...would you continue it??


A: About 40% of kids on the spectrum have a mutant

MTHFR gene. Give the mb-12, you bypass the mutant

MTHFR problem.

Aluminum is not pulled out by dmps. EDTA pulls

aluminum. When I do a challenge I use an oral pill,

then parents see what is pulled out. With transdermal,

we don’t know how much is absorbed, etc. After we see

the challenge works, I switch to transdermal.


Q: Hi Dr. Neubrander, thank you so much for all your

wonderful work. My son has done very well on MB12. He

is 6 years old and has been on it since he was 2 1/2.

Last year we did the high dose daily and after a few

weeks he got a fever and then he doubled his

expressive language practically overnight. Now we are

back to every 3 days. Do you have any experience with

children coming off the shots after a few years?


A: Most of mine stay on the shots. Some come off, you

could try it and see. The fever and mb-12 isn’t

connected. Sometimes children have their best language

when they have a fever.


Q: Twin daughters on Methyl-b12 since Oct. 18 from

another DAN! doctor. First appointment with your PA

on Nov 19. My question: Previous DAN! doc had girls

on l-theanine. I am about to run out of l-theanine

and don't really want to start again, but worried

about changing mid-stream. Thoughts?


A: Don’t stop. You’ll be in soon enough, keep going

for now.


Q: Is a MTHFR SNP a primary indicator for MB12 shots?

The reason I ask is my son tested negative for the

SNP. He is, unfortunately a consistent non-responder

to therapies. Also, in your experience with HBOT, how

long does it usually take to see the greatest benefit

and how many dives would you generally suggest for

maximum benefit? We did 10 dives in mid-October

with-so far-not much impact.


A: MTHFR SNP about 40% of kids have. We have 94%

response, not saying the intensity of the response,

but 94% respond. The body knows what it needs, a lab

test doesn’t. Doctors put too much trust in lab tests.

They sometimes lead you to not do things you should.

For HBOT, don’t even think about analyzing whether

effective until 20-40 dives.


Q: (1) Even though I do understand that 99.9% of the

time it is against your religion, what are the

exceptional circumstances under which you would say

TMG is OK to use along with MB12 and folinic acid? (2)

If using TD-DMPS, what would you use to "challenge"

orally--is oral DMSA ok or would oral DMPS be more

appropriate as a challenge?


A: I always use mb-12 and folinic whenever a child can

take it, only 20% of my kids can’t tolerate. I haven’t

seen TMG work enough to want to use it.

Oral DMSA is ok. DMPS is stronger, but DMSA does a

fine job. If you’re going to chelate, chelate a year

or a year ½, and try not to drive yourself crazy with

the urine challenges.


Q: Hi Dr N my 8 year old son, who I’ve been giving

m12 for about 3 months, I haven’t seen any negative

or positive things yet. I've been following your

protocol what am i doing wrong? no TMG and I’m giving

him Nu thera and also battling yeast and I'm also

doing chelation and NO improvement whatsoever. He is

also has no speech. On the other hand my 7 year old

son has been doing a lot of improvement but he has a

lot sensory issues and he's very jumpy.


A: Use the parent-designed report form to look for

changes. I don’t know if you’re doing anything wrong.

You might not be at my dosage of nuthera. Get the

yeast under control. Get on the full dose of


Very jumpy, you have to figure out if it’s from the

mb-12, and if it’s tolerable or not. Make sure you use

the parent-designed report. Make sure you’re off

dairy, because dairy blocks.


Q: My son is 7, very mildly ASD (always has been).

Very insensitive to any supplements or interventioin

except ABA. We started chelation recently saw some

good results (rare for him) . My question is we can't

do GFCF diet 100% anymore as he tell lies and do

tricks on us to eat them at school or friends' houses.

Is it better we just don't do the diet instead of on

and off on and off with it? Someone say it's a lot

of harm to be back and forth on the diet.


A: It’s not harmful to be on and off. The harm is that

you might expect benefit, and it’s not. You have to

make a decision if it’s going to drive you crazy or

not. I don’t see if you’re doing mb-12 or not.


Q: My question was re transdermal NAC -- concerns from

Pangborn and Baker book re possibly "worsening

contamination" by binding Hg without excreting it.


A: There is a lot of hypothesis on NAC. I know a lot

of the doctors are using it. I haven’t read that yet,

so I don’t know.


Q: I ordered the shots from one pharmacy(which is on

the certified list) but these shots came with air

bubble inside, the pharmacist is OK with that but just

want to confirm that if you have a concern or not?

thank you and its so amazing listening to you tonight.


A: Air bubbles don’t really matter. When they fill

them, as long as the caps aren’t full of the medicine,

they pull it back ,and air bubbles get in. I guess it

could be a little contaminated with air, but the air

bubble will not kill you. It’s a tv thing. Air bubbles

are bad when you go into a big central vein. But this

little air bubble in a syringe is safe.


Q: my son is 7 an 80 lb. he is on vitamins and

minerals - brainchild ..mb12 and folinic . his

attention is getting worse no focus at all



A: I don’t know enough from what you’ve told me.

Brainchild has tmg in it.


Q: Hello, Dr. I know nothing about Hyperbaric Oxygen

Treatment. Can you basically explain what does it

consist of and what is it that it's supposed to do?


A: Oxygen under pressure. Hospitals have used it for

years, for stroke, diabetes, cerebral palsy. They use

chambers that can be under high pressure. You go in

for a certain amount of time. We have smaller

chambers to just under 2 atmospheres. Not dangerous.

Nothing that will hurt a person. Can’t go in with

congestion. It oxygenates the blood in the brain,

allows more oxygen to get in deeper. There is theory

that the cells that sit further from a blood vessel

are not dead, but sleeping. Under pressure the blood

can get to them, and make the sleeping cells active

again. In SPECT scans, you can see before and after

the brain scan. Purple and blue are cold. After 20-40

you will see more orange and red, hot, the brain cells

back on.


Q: We've been doing mB12 shots for the last 10 months

or so. The problem is that we never did a

5-weeks-B12-only with the parent report, like you

recommend. My son is doing very well, but I have no

idea whether it's the B12 or other things (or the

combination) that's responsible for the improvements.

Is there anything you recommend for patients like my

son who are on B12 but haven't done your 5-week

protocol? Should we stop for a time, then restart and

do your 5-week protocol? Or just keep going? Thanks

for all your advice!


A: The mb-12 and the other stuff is probably all

working. Don’t stop and restart. The brain is coming

alive, the pathways are starting to work. Do not stop.

It’s working well for your son. Once you’re a

responder, take for 2-3 years, maybe for life.


Q: My ASD daughter is on GFCFSF diet. Recently her

hair is thinning. She is a very picky eater; could

this be low protein (only meat she eats is bacon)?


A: These children as a rule have poor absorption, esp

with protein. Could be her diet, could be low protein.

She might need a lab test.


Q: A question not directly related to mb12 but I hope

can get your insights, it's always puzzled us: my son

performs better when he has certain mild fever, and

does better in the evening than in the day, very

consistently. Any thoughts?


A: Better in the evening - we all have our own

circadian rhythm. I can’t say what it is, but there

are different things in day/night. Some kids do do

well during fevers.


Q: Do you treat many kids for PANDAS? What is your

treatment protocol if so? Also, back to HBOT, is it

critical that the 20-40 dives take place within a

short time frame? Thanks so much.


A: I do treat some. We have different treatment

protocols, I won’t go into it here. With HBOT, we

don’t know that yet, the general consensus is if you

do fewer then 3 x a week you’re probably wasting your

money. Daily is probably better. We’re still studying



Q: my son is 7 on mb12,folonic acid, gfcf, probiotics,

dmg and omega 3 and enzymes. His attention is gettng

worse and he is unable to focus in class or at home

with his homework. In fact I could say his attention

seems to be worse than ever. Any thoughts ? some

suggested i stop DMG and see what happens but I know

it started before I introduced DMG.He is also on

brainchild vitamins and minerals .he gets the mb12

from hopewell and we use your protocol. folinic is

from thorne twice daily 800mg,probiotics and enzymes

from Klaire 1 tablet twice daily. by the way his mb-12

is 2110 mcg..,twice a week. I read about calcium

deficiency and I see he is not getting enough calcium.

Can that create this much problem ? or anything else?


A: I don’t know, it takes individual hand-holding, I

can’t tell from this if it’s seasonal, or what else

you’re doing. Brainchild does have tmg. 2110 mcg is a

funny number – I don’t know his weight. Get on the

supplements according to my approach.


Q: Dr Neubrander What works with Methyl B12 and how do

know when to add what works with it?


A: Basically my protocol is available. My full

supplement schedule program is available.


Q: What is your experience with transdermal NAC --

what benefit do you notice from it. My son is on GFCF,

TMG, betaine, Zn, methyl B12 750 mcg twice a week (he

is about 50 lbs). He is supposed to start transdermal

NAC, tho I have not after reading the concerns by

Pangborn and Baker.


A: You’re not anywhere close to my protocol, so I

can’t tell you what to do. TMG and DMG are against my

religion. I don’t know how this is going to work. It

could be right, but it’s not my protocol, and I can’t

compare it.

People are making claims NAC gets rid of mercury,

Pangborn and Baker said ‘not true’ and that it might

even sequester it. I don’t have time to get into all

that here. I can’t comment on your protocol.


Q: Thank you Dr N, my son has been on MB12 for a year

now. We got good result. Recently we switched MB12 to

follow your recommendation. It's really big gain.

Thanks. But we also saw some hyper behaviors. Any

recommendation. We don't want to switch back.


A: I get more side effects, but also more results,

then others. The doses I give might give more side

effects (about 30% of my kids). The angle should be

30% or less. Stay out of the muscle. Less side effects

if you can get the shot into the fat.


Q: Anything from the DAN! conference you are

particularly excited about and are going to

incorporate into your practice? Thanks for your MB12

work -- I have a slow and steady responder!


A: Higher dose vitamin C, HBOT, LDN, Actos, a lot of

exciting things.

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