ilovedogs

One more question? What is the dosage amounts you give your children? My ds is 12 and weighs just under 100 lbs. Thx

So glad that you all are getting positive feedback from doctors in different fields of practice. I know my son really relies on it these days and I know he likes to have it available to him. He takes around 400 mcg most nights. I just want to make sure I'm not doing any harm to his own production of melatonin.

My 12 year old ds has been having trouble with sleep. He takes well over an hour on a regular basis to sleep so I let him try melatonin back in December. He loves it and says he falls asleep in about 10 minutes after turning off his light. I brought this up to our naturopath and he had concerns. He says I shouldn't use it every day and that I should vary the dose and he was also concerned that supplementation with melatonin might suppress the body's own creation of the hormone. I noticed that many of you give melatonin for sleep issues and I was wondering what your doctors(GPs, DANs, neurologists, etc) have to say about the use of melatonin. Do they caution against it? Do they say you can use it for extended periods of time? Personally, I was really surprised that our naturopath wasn't keen on us using it so I figured I'd ask here and see what other's experiences have been. Thanks! Bonnie

Just wanted to add that I have a friend who uses Kumon for her boys, who have no neuro issues, btw. She loves it. Kumon starts all kids at the same level, it's up to the kids on how they progress. I've been doing review speed drills with my ds, he's 12, because I know he knows the answers but he has a hard time transferring the answers to the paper. I have considered Kumon but he's actually doing really well now that I'm focusing on reviewing the tables(addition, subtraction, multiplication, division) and since we homeschool I have been blaming myself for him being almost 2 years behind in math. We also do a website called bigmathtime.com and that gives him good review and keeps him practicing his problems without having to write down answers since he seems to be pencil-phobic, LOL!

Just wanted to say that you all are doing such a good job at managing your kids diets, etc. I don't do any of that and I always have waxing and waning. The only real triggers I know are moon cycles(yes, the full moon can bring on waxing), environmental allergies, and stress(good and bad). Most of these triggers I really can't avoid. We use a HEPA filtration system in his room. My vacuum is a HEPA and I have tried NAET, as well, but didn't see any results from it. I still haven't gotten around to ordering the multi vitamin but I will probably do it soon. I also have been slacking off on giving him his magnesium, too. Right now we've got some major blinking and shoulder shrugging going on but they don't really amp up until evening for him. He has been back to taking melatonin more regularly and I want to back him off of it, but he has terrible sleep issues and he really likes how the melatonin helps him fall asleep quicker than usual. He said he's asleep usually within 10 minutes of turning out his light whereas before it was an hour, sometimes more. I'm still trying to get a good feel for using the melatonin. I'm running into folks who have kids without neuro issues who are being told by their pediatricians that it's ok to give melatonin, yet my naturopath wants me to shy away from using it regularly and he wants me to always give varying doses(I break tablets down to about 2.5 mcg to 4 mcg most nights but the doses are hard to be accurate about since the tablets don't break evenly). Bonnie

We have homeschooled since ds was 5. I am heading out right now but will come back later and tell you our story and what we like and dislike about homeschooling! Bonnie

I've never seen that tic before but wanted to just send you a cyberhug!!! ((mom2ck)) I am so tired of watching my own son tic, he hasn't had a tic free day since they started 3 years ago. Granted most of his tics are minor, eye blinking, eyebrow raising, shoulder shrugging, mouth grimaces, head turning, mouth grimaces, etc but there are so many other issues that we have that I know get tied into it all and I can't find a good doctor for the life of me out here. We've had bedwetting issues, sleep problems, tics, environmental allergies, anxiety, stress issues, and in the past we had some OCD type anxiety. It just drags me down and I wonder how on earth we're going to get through these upcoming teen years. It sounds like you have a good plan for him. I hope the DAN doc has some answers for you! Please feel free to come back on and share! Bonnie

I haven't read any studies that say that starting tics early will mean more severity as they age. I think it's highly individual for each child. We have no history of TS in our family, nor OCD(my father in law has anxiety issues but not OCD, as does my husband). Anyway, my son starting ticcing the day he turned 9 and he hasn't had a tic free day since. He's 12 now. We do epsom salts and magnesium supplements but I don't really see those things helping. He thinks the epsom baths help his muscles relax, though, as he is a very athletic kid and plays tennis and trains daily. As for getting a cold and ticcing; illness is definitely a trigger. For my son, it's a fever that gets him ticcing more not necessarily a cold itself. And, allergies seem to make him tic more so keeping histamine low is important to us to help control the tics. Lots of folks on here have found that sugar, dairy, corn, gluten, etc can exacerbate tics. And, we've all found that a healthy diet can also keep tics minimal. Cutting out artificial colors, preservatives, dyes, nitrates, and MSG are all helpful to the overall health of kids who have neurological issues. I am not stringent on these with my son, but we do limit artificial colors and preservatives most of the time. I also stay away from MSG and all of it's derivatives, it goes by a lot of other names like hydrolyzed yeast, blah, blah....I can't remember some of the others, LOL. Anyway, I think it's good to adopt a philosophy that you will take each day at a time, do the best you can to work with the tics and neurological issues daily, and pat yourself on the back for being a great mom for caring so much! Bonnie

You know, the reason we let ds start playing tournaments for tennis was to help build his confidence and I truly believe it has done just that. He certainly does tic more during tournaments but it's something that he's good at and it has created a 'family' of friends that we have met, people from all over the country. He competes nationally and has friends from MN, NM, TX, CA, FL, GA, MD, etc that he communicates with on Facebook so I made sure that I have access to his account on FB and his messages get filtered through my gmail account. This is how I found out about the bullying, ds never told me. It actually didn't bother him as much as it bothered me, go figure, LOL. Thanks for the words of support everyone! And, Cloudy: I've always wondered where some of the regular posters go? Did their kids grow out of the tics? Did they go the conventional route and do meds and thus stopped posting? I guess we'll never know. I'd like to think that their kids have outgrown the tics and that life moved on for them. Of course, that could just be wishful thinking on my part.

My son is 12 now and he's at a point in his life where he's searching for friends and groups of friends, etc. He's a follower. We homeschool and he has 2 homeschool friends who are really nice boys but some of the kids he meets through his tennis life are a bit too worldly for my liking. Totally regardless of the tics, kids make fun of him a lot and tease him because he's very silly and immature for his age. I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that he's very individual and immature(in a good way), he's very ADHD, very excitable, still laughs like a little girl(his voice is years away from changing), and he tries to be everybody's friend. Anyway, we've had an issue with him being bullied on Facebook. I allowed him to get a FB account hoping it would open up his friendships a bit where he could find doubles partners for tennis and talk to his friends more online. Unfortunately, my plan has backfired. 2 of the boys from the tennis community have ganged up on him calling him g*y, making fun of him, making fun of our last name, called him a momma's boy, etc. They used foul language, too, through their whole thread. It was quite disheartening for me. And, these boys aren't friends of his on Facebook, they are attacking him on other kids pages and many of the girls who have read it have told their parents that they felt it was bullying and that they don't participate in it. And, the parents have come to me telling me that their girls are aware of these boys and are keeping their distance, thankfully. Anyway, I haven't spoken to these boys' parents as one of the sets of parents usually says this about their boys, "Well, you know, boys will be boys." And, the other is a whole long story and hopefully I will run into him at the next tournament so I can bring it up. I guess I'm just so worried for his future. I have heard so many parents on these boards and on other local TS boards who have said that their kids have gotten worse in the mid to late teen years with the tics and OCD stuff. I always thought that at age 12 we were in the thick of it by now. I can't find a decent doctor around here who treats tics naturally as I've hit a road block with our current naturopath. I'm trying to decide if I should put braces on ds this next year because he really will need them and it sickens me to think that the ortho work may make tics worse for him. As if braces aren't bad enough! I've just hit a parenting setback, I guess, where I feel overwhelmed and unprepared for the upcoming teen years. It's like I have this feeling that we need to go live on a farm in Montana for the next 8 years so I can hide ds from society so he can tic and be himself and not worry about friends, the internet, school, etc. but I know that's ridiculous. But, it has crossed my mind, LOL!

Thanks for the update, Megan! I'm thinking of ordering those progressive vitamins. We still wax and wane and I wonder what the future will hold. You know, for me I'd really like to find a good alternative therapy doctor because I'm feeling at a dead end with our naturopath these days. I just hate the fact that we'll have to start over again with someone new.

Patty, I thought the ortho treatment was going well, I didn't realize that he had an OCD spike afterwards. I am totally debating when to put braces on my son. His teeth are so crowded and he has an overbite and the dentist is now pushing for them but I'm so afraid it will increase his tics or OCD stuff. He's been doing so well for the past 1.5 years, mostly with the anxiety as we still have the tics that wax and wane. Technically, I know we could wait forever to put braces on him but he's 12 and that's the age when many of his friends are getting them and when it seems 'popular'. Just wanted to add that I agree with Chris: you all are amazing parents for doing what you are doing with your kids!

He might just be waxing just because he is. Yet, there are so many factors to consider, not just allergies. Stress(good and bad) and even the cycle of the moon seem to affect my ds' tics more so that his allergies. Have you tried nightly epsom salts baths? They may not stop the tics for us but they do relax ds enough so he can get a good night's rest and he seems calmer and less 'ticcy' in the AM, especially if he's waxing. As for the magnesium: I give a liquid cal/mag supplement from either Bluebonnet or Lifetime vitamins. My ds doesn't like the Natural Calm as he just doesn't care for the taste so we've been using these liquids for at least a year. I honestly can't say if they help but I believe in magnesium supplementation for everyone in our family, not just for ds for tics.

Liz, would you mind mentioning which fatty acids you were using? And, which stress relief herbs worked for you guys? Chemar has found that lemon balm and jasmine and chamomile seem to relieve stress the best for her son. I've tried the chamomile and the jasmine and they really haven't helped my ds at all. PS: how old is your son and how old is your brother? Thanks, Bonnie

I didn't want your thread to get buried, but I wanted to tell you that you may want to send a PM(private message) to CSP. She had been trying Krill oil with her teenage son and I was curious to know her results, too. I have krill oil here at the house but I have yet to give it to ds for his tics and ADD stuff. Bonnie

Happy New Year to you, too! Can't believe it's already the 2nd, where does the time go? Bonnie

We tend to take this approach quite a bit. Ds definitely waxes and wanes with the tics and I know that allergies and stress seem to exacerbate them, but I have chosen to be WAY more relaxed about everything. It's been 3 years of tics and the good times seem to outweigh the bad at this point. Yes, there are times when he seems to tic quite a bit, but really they don't interfere with his functioning in society and I seem way more bothered by them than he is. So, I just stick with the basics: try as hard as I can to keep the junk out of the diet(hard to do with a 12 year old boy), epsom salts baths when needed, magnesium/calcium supplementation daily, Vitamin C, positive and encouraging feedback from dh and I, and a relaxed home atmosphere seem to be the best thing for him. Right now we're at a HUGE national tennis tournament that he barely qualified for so he's ticcing quite a bit. He started a new one yesterday where it looks like he's shivering, but just his face and cheeks shake. It's kind of a cute one. He's also streching his mouth, shrugging his shoulder, and sometimes I see the eye blinking. He took an epsom salts bath tonight and I try to only talk positive about his performance on court. We stress 'have fun' as much as possible for him to keep his stress levels low. He puts enough pressure on himself to win, he certainly doesn't need us coming down on him. Anyway, I have come to expect the increase in tics at tournaments. Hotel environment, eating on the road and travel, and the pressure playing the top competitive kids in the country can be pretty stressful! And, honestly, most kids don't notice his tics. He's got girls starting to text him quite frequently these days so I know they definitely don't hamper his social life, LOL! Bonnie

Hello and welcome to the message boards. First thing to remember (and I tell myself this often): these tics will pass, they will wax and wane in severity and intensity. So, the best thing to do is not to draw attention to them. If your son complains of discomfort you can address that, obviously, but don't ask them to stop as this often makes it worse and increases the tic. Epsom salts baths are an excellent way to relax the muscles and promote sleep. Just dissolve 2 cups of epsom salts in a bath and have him soak for about 20 mins. My ds(he's 12) loves epsom salts baths more for relaxation and help for sore muscles than for his tics. Second, don't panic. Keep reading some threads here and you'll see that you are not alone. My son started with tics when he was 9 and, after all this time, I can truly say that they don't bother him as much as they bother me. The best supplement to start with is magnesium. Most people on here give the Peter Gilham's Natural Calm. I actually give a liquid calcium/magnesium supplement from Country Life vitamins. You can find good supplements online at iherb or vitacost or at your local health food store. You are correct about the anxiety and excitement of Christmas. My son definitely tics more when he's excited, both good stress and bad stress can increase the frequency and sometimes bring about new tics that disappear once the stress is gone. Deep breathing, relaxation exercises, and just keeping things low key are all good ideas for any kids who are maxed out from holiday stress. As for the appointment with the neurologist, don't expect much at this point. You will probably get a typical response which is: your child has a tic disorder, possibly Tourette's and you can try medication or just wait and see. This seems to be the general consensus around here. It certainly couldn't hurt to go to the doctor just for your own peace of mind, if you need it. I have a few friends who have tried or are still using meds for their kids tics and the meds just seem to reduce the frequency and intensity. Many people on these boards here have gotten the same relief for their children by experimenting with different things like: searching for a hidden food allergy, food sensitivity, environmental allergies and sensitivities, heavy metal toxicity, candida overgrowth, etc. Yet, many of us know the contributing factors that make the tics worse for our children, not all of us have found 'the cure', so to speak, but we have found ways to help our children be more comfortable with themselves and by gaining knowledge about tics and neurological conditions we have empowered ourselves to better help our children. Happy learning and Happy New Year! Bonnie

I really need to start getting him off the computer by 9 PM, giving him some lemon balm tea, and upping the magnesium. Right now he's in a period where he can't fall asleep before 11:30, no matter what time we try to get him to bed. I gave some melatonin for about 4 days straight and yes, it helped him fall asleep in about 10 mins, but I don't trust it long term. He asked for it tonight but I said no. It's 11:16 and he's still tossing and turning in bed and it's driving me crazy! It's like I feel guilty about falling asleep before him so I sit here and wait for him to fall asleep and then I'm the one waking up tired the next day, LOL!

Just wanted to add that I started using the melatonin for ds for the past 4 days. We had gotten back from Hawaii last Friday early AM(just around 1 AM) as he's been struggling with falling asleep since then. He was awake at midnight one evening so I gave him 1/4th of a 3mg tablet and he was asleep within 15 mins. I took 1/2 of a 3mg tablet and even though it helped me fall asleep, I was VERY groggy and sleepy in the AM. It seems to stay with me for about 12 hours so I know I would need to cut the dose back in the future. Chemar, for how long can I give melatonin? Do you think it's safe to give daily? I still need to order some lemon balm tea but I was thinking of trying the Celestial Seasonings chamomile tea that has valerian in it. I just haven't researched the melatonin enough or the valerian, either. Ds asked for it last night at around 11 PM so I gave him 1/4th(maybe even a bit less) and I didn't hear from him again. Of course, I was exhausted because our neighbor's dog keeps waking me up at 6:30 and had had a long day so I fell asleep myself pretty quickly, without the melatonin.

Well, I shop at both TJ's and Whole Foods but there are 2 stores that are close than WF that I frequent at least weekly. Unfortunately, they are regionally located so you may not have one in your neck of the woods. I shop almost exclusively at Sprouts Farmers Markets and sometimes at Sunflower Farmers Markets. Both stores sell the supplements I use on a regular basis(although I do most of my ordering through Iherb) and they have all the GF foods, alternative sugars, alternative flours, lots of organic meats and veggies, etc. and great deals on bulk food items. I shop at TJs mostly for specific items that I know the family likes or that I know I will need to have on hand for recipes, etc. As for WF, I don't get there very often because I find most everything I need at the other stores, but when I do go I like to buy their organic everyday 360 line as it's reasonably priced.

kat, you're right: do one change at a time. If you try to change too much at one time you won't know exactly what it is that's working. Cleaning up the diet and then adding magnesium is a great first step. Then try elimination diets, tackling the allergens, etc. B

Adding to what Lynn said here; changing a few things in the diet are always positives even if they don't help with tics. Getting rid of MSG, high fructose corn syrup, nitrated meats, and food colorings are easy changes to make. My son finds the epsom salts baths very relaxing and will specifically ask for one if he's had an active day. Actually, we all do epsom salt foot soaks a few times a week as a family since we're pretty active and our feet ache often, LOL! Welcome to the boards, too! I forgot to do this first. I have to be honest and tell you that my 12 year old son has been ticcing for 3 years now and I haven't seen a benefit from any changes I've made. But, I have to also be honest and say that I haven't been as diligent as I needed to be in terms of cleaning up his diet or in keeping up with supplements. His tics really don't bother him so much, not as much as they bother me(being honest here). We have never seen a doctor of any kind for his tics except for our naturopath. Personally, I might try a psychiatrist of some sort but mainly for cognitive behavior therapy, not necessarily for a diagnosis. Also, I wanted to tell you that my son plays competitive tennis. He travels around the country and holds a national ranking in the boys 12 division. He trains hard and works out, and spends a lot of time on the court. I have found the tennis to be one of the best things for him: it builds his confidence, he's made friends from all over the country, and it gives his very active body an outlet. Allergies can play a huge role in tics. We have found that ds tics the most when exposed to allergens, mostly environmental( we see more tics in the fall and spring). Histamine increasing in the body can also increase norepinephrine which, in turn, increases dopamine which can contribute to tics. Most people who tic have higher levels of dopamine but have lower levels of seratonin. You may also want to start her on some probiotics or eating yogurt daily, etc. Seratonin is produced in the gastro system and a healthy gastro system can only benefit overall physical and mental health. Other things that can contribute to tics are reactions to chlorine, new carpet or cleaning products, etc. Basically, environmental or chemical sensitivities including mold can raise those histamine levels and disrupt the neurological pathways. Hope this helps! Bonnie

Thanks, CP, but he doesn't really like nuts, especially walnuts. I might try the melatonin if it becomes a problem. I'm now thinking it is more of a situational thing and I'm hoping we get a full night's sleep tonight!

Funny, he was going to do an epsom salts bath last night but changed his mind. I did give him about 300 mg of magnesium before bed. I think it's anxiety related to the tournament this weekend, but I still need to make sure he gets his rest. Hopefully, he'll catch up a bit this weekend now that we're here. I still need to order some lemon balm tea but I think chamomile should help, as well. Thanks for the info on the melatonin. If this becomes more problematic or not just tied to a tournament or travel event, I may try the teas first and then move up to the melatonin. So, you really think the lemon balm tea helps that much, Char? I keep forgetting to order some online but I think it's worth a shot. I have been diffusing lavender and chamomile in a diffuser in his room when he goes to bed so I wonder if that helps on most normal days for him. It took me until this AM to realize that he was probably anxious last night about a tennis tournament this weekend even though he didn't come right out and say it. His lack of sleep didn't affect his game this AM as he still managed to get in a win, but I don't want lack of sleep to become an issue for him because I know how lack of sleep can really set off the tics, etc.