Need some help

[san70]

After a great summer with very few tics, here we are back to school and my ds is in a major waxing period. His tics are many...neck, squeaking noise with his mouth, finger stretching, body stretching. Everything is really pretty intense. He does enjoy school. He's in third grade. He does take Mag taurate and our diet is pretty clean. It takes him over 2 hours at night to fall asleep so I know he is tired. His attitude is ridiculous. He is mouthy, disrespectful, and mean. He is physical with his 5 1/2 year old brother. They love to play together but he is often pushing or grabbing him. I don't know what to do. I am so upset and stressed. Any advice on how to deal with him? Punishments send him into tantrum mode but I can't allow him to act this way without consequence. He is very intense. Please help!

[Chemar]

Hi

it sounds like something is majorly triggering him

 

have you had a strep test?

 

has he been exposed to any pesticides, either indoor or on sports fields etc

 

new paint? new woodwork? new carpeting? new car?

 

whenever my son had both tics PLUS mood waxing there was usually a food or environmental toxic trigger or an infection or even a tooth coming in or out

 

hope you manage to help things get stabilized soon!

[CarolynN]

Hello,

 

I wanted to share with you what I do when my son's tics/anxiety get going. This is what my Naturopathic doctor shared with me. He told me to give Daniel 150 mg's of B6 for 3 to 4 days. I divide it up during the day in smaller doses. I have to consider how much B6 he was getting in his multi-vitamin (Bonnie Grimaldi's TS-Plus) so I empty out some of the B6 in the capsules to make sure he was not getting over the 150 mgs. After the three to four days I go back to my standard dose of just over 50 mg's a day.

 

The other thing I do for him is give him 10,000 mg's of Glycine for eight days. Glycine is an amino acid (again broken down throughout the day and even at midnight). Glycine helps the neurotransmitters run more smooth. After eight days (I never have had to go this long in giving him that high of a dose. It usually only takes about 2 to 3 days) I go back to the normal dose of 4600 mg's a day. I don't know what medical conditions would keep someone from doing the glycine, at this high of a level, so I would certainly run it by a doctor.

 

The other thing that really helps is Epsom Salts bath's. I give him, up to two baths a day when things are bad, and we put 2 cups in a full tub of water and soak for 20 minutes.

 

I have my son drink LOTS of water to help flush out the toxins and also the excessive neurotransmitters. My son does not enjoy drinking a lot of water at once so I will give him ice chips. He finds that more fun. It certainly seems to help some getting the extra water in him..

 

Another thing I do is give him N-Acetyl-L-Cysteine, up to 1200 mgs, a day. I divide up the doses 600 mgs in the morning and 600 mgs at night. This helps remove toxins from the body by aiding the liver.

 

I hope this helps some. I know how frustrating it is when you think things have settled down and then there are the tics again. All I can say is use those times to really do some detective work to see if you can figure out a pattern. This is where food journals come in handy. I know for my son, he can typically handle a few products of artificial foods in his body, but once he has had too much his body will start reacting. So for your child it may have been a slow buildup of too much of what he is sensitive too.

 

Have a good evening,

 

Carolyn

[faith]

Carolyn,

If I could just ask, (let's pretend I never did before ), when you give the extra glycine and NAC, you just give it all day long for several days and then he eventually calms down after a few days? In the meantime, he does not react with INCREASE? I wish I had the guts to try this, but I have had such bad experiences with aminos and the new supplements, that I keep swearing off them, then I try again, and again have a major relapse. could this all be coincidence? just don't know. Sometimes I wonder if the reaction is because it is doing "something", but I have to keep going, but again, no guts.

 

Faith

[CSP]

First I want to say I'm sorry, san70, that this is not a good start to the new school year.

 

I for some reason have the same fear as faith about the amino acids. For some reason they have a negative effect on my son's neurotransmitters. Maybe it is only the dopamine, serotonin, and norepinephrine, I don't know. I'm wondering if the dopemine in some TSers are just more powerful then the other neurotransmitters, so it pushes it's way to the brain easier.

 

Carolyn, I have glycine down as an intervention for compounds of bacterial or yeast/fungal origins on my son's organic acid profile. Could you tell me why that is so? And does that have any reason why you use it.

 

san70, I would look into what chemar said and if you can not find a connection, try boosting your son's mood with more carbohydrates and less protein.

 

CP

[ilovedogs]

CP, I use the glycine, too, as Carolyn does and our naturopath told us it calms the pathways and the neurotransmitters helping things run more smoothly. I know there's more but I do give it to Griffin about every other day to every day depending on whether he's waxing or not. That combined with high B6 seems to take him from an 8 to a 2 on a scale of 1 to 10(10 being highest). We've had bad reactions from 5HTP and I do see waxing with fish oils. Haven't tried other aminos, though.

 

San, we usually get major waxing when a tooth is coming in(or out) or when he's very stressed. Is there something going on at school with a classmate or was the classroom just painted or has new carpeting? I know my ds also increased tics when we pulled out our carpeting and put in tile last spring.

 

B

[CSP]

Thanks Bonnie,

 

So we need to use it with B6? (what it high doses to you) Well, Faith, I'm willing to give it a try, are you willing to do it at the same time?

 

I should know right away if he starts with his high pitched squeak.

 

CP

[san70]

My ds is having major teeth issues going on. His mouth looks like that of a shark's. He has about 5 loose teeth and 2 or 3 that have the adult teeth already grown in behind the baby teeth. I can't really pinpoint anything environmental within the house but who knows at school. Stress and anxiety are triggers for him. He has not had any sicknesses and I know strep may not present itself with symptoms. We do have waxing at the beginning of the year but this seems really severe. I know he is approaching the age of tics peaking, too.

 

I am wondering if I should start with B6? My ds is very skinny. He is 8 1/2, is about 50 inches and weighs 50 lbs. Any recommendations on dosages? Are all B6 vitamins the same? When I searched on magnesium, I learned a whole lot about all the different types (taurate, citrate, etc.). Is it the same for B6? Any potential side effects?

[faith]

CP,

I have given the B6 at 100 mgs. and it seems to be okay. I have a Carlson liquid B6 that says 1/2 tsp. is 100 mgs. and I have given that 2x a day a couple of times recently. Again, it seems to be okay. I have the glycine and NAC on hand, but no dear, I'm sorry, you will not tempt me to try that again, lol. (remember the NAC incident?).......and I'm still looking at the carnitine with squinty eyes. As far as his vocal goes, I tried the carnitine at the time thinking "well, it can't get any worse"....and it did. wether it was those things or not, who knows, but just too chicken right now.

 

You go first, kay? then maybe.......

 

Faith

[ilovedogs]

Faith and CP, I do not have to give the glycine with the B6. Actually, I hadn't given him glycine for a few days after I started a high B6 regimen. I added that afterwards and then I saw the tics really slow down. As for the B6, our naturopath told us to do 200mg for 3 days, spreading it out throughout the day. Carolyn goes up to 150 mg for Daniel. I didn't see a change until day 4, though, so it was something that took time and was not an immediate band-aid.

 

Faith, have you tried going up to 200 mg of the B6? I was leary of it, but Griffin seemed to have no ill effects from it. He weighs around 77 lbs and is around 4 ft 7 in height.

 

To answer San's question on the B6: I just use whatever B6 is in capsule form so I can open the capsule and dissolve it in juice. Faith uses a liquid and I'm sure that's fine, as well.

 

B

[CarolynN]

Carolyn,

If I could just ask, (let's pretend I never did before ), when you give the extra glycine and NAC, you just give it all day long for several days and then he eventually calms down after a few days? In the meantime, he does not react with INCREASE? I wish I had the guts to try this, but I have had such bad experiences with aminos and the new supplements, that I keep swearing off them, then I try again, and again have a major relapse. could this all be coincidence? just don't know. Sometimes I wonder if the reaction is because it is doing "something", but I have to keep going, but again, no guts.

 

Faith

 

 

Faith,

 

No he does not react with an increase at all from the supplements.

 

But I also have to say the B6 is a HUGE part too. If you are at all afraid why not increase the B6 even up to 150 mg's for two or three days and go back to the standard 50 mg's. I cannot even begin to say how much that has helped him.

 

It is so hard for me to pinpoint one particular supplement because for Daniel he seems to need some of each. But I also know what is triggering him which is obviously the chemical foods. So for me it is easier to figure out what supplements are needed to counteract this reaction.

 

Carolyn

[faith]

Okay, today I'm giving the 100 mg. (1/2 tsp.) of the B6 this morning, and then I'll give another later when he gets home from school. so that will be 200 mg. I'm not afraid of that, because I've given him the B6 for a while now and I give it with the Natural Calm magnesium.

 

I gave in to a slice of pizza last night, which shouldn't be a big deal because I don't restrict wheat, and I was trying no dairy for a few weeks but am sneaking some cheeses in here and there in small amounts, ..... but I do try to limit outside foods. when I left the pizza place I noticed big jugs of soybean oil, and I don't care for soy or soybean anything in my son's diet because I think he reacts, so I was a little leary. I'm guessing they use that for frying and one of them said salad oil, but who knows if the pizza dough or sauce they make contains any of that soybean oil. .

 

I'll let you know where we stand in a few days.

 

Faith

[Chemar]

After a great summer with very few tics, here we are back to school and my ds is in a major waxing period. His tics are many...neck, squeaking noise with his mouth, finger stretching, body stretching. Everything is really pretty intense. He does enjoy school. He's in third grade. He does take Mag taurate and our diet is pretty clean. It takes him over 2 hours at night to fall asleep so I know he is tired. His attitude is ridiculous. He is mouthy, disrespectful, and mean. He is physical with his 5 1/2 year old brother. They love to play together but he is often pushing or grabbing him. I don't know what to do. I am so upset and stressed. Any advice on how to deal with him? Punishments send him into tantrum mode but I can't allow him to act this way without consequence. He is very intense. Please help!

 

just bumping this original post back up for san

[san70]

Well, while I believe that part of the waxing is due to school, I think there is a definite connection to his incoming teeth. This evening, while brushing his teeth, he decided to try to take one of his loose teeth out. Well, he made it bleed and it hurt him a bit. While I explained that this was a good thing since he made his tooth even looser, it is still hanging on in his mouth and boy did his mouth tic really present itself! It is practically nonstop! So, this loose tooth thing is definitely a trigger for him and so I think we may have a bumpy road ahead of us since he has many loose teeth! I am going look into the B6. Any advice from experienced moms out there for the disrespectful attitude of an 8 year old? He has quite a temper and a mouth. Is this normal??

 

Thanks to everyone. I don't know what I would do with out the board's help and support.

 

San

[love_nfp]

Ditto on the Epsom salt baths, B6 and magnesium. One thing that has been a lifesaver for us has been sports. He can release some tension and sometimes the tics are easily disguised while playing sports. It also gives him something to look forward to. My son is the type of kid who has to have the carrot in front of him. The only other thing that I can offer is that you're not alone. My son can be so terribly mean to his siblings. The nasty, disrespectful behaviour especially towards me is hard to live with. One thing that has helped was listening to one of the Total Transformation CD's. Without realizing it, things here got to where my son was "running the show". Everything revolved around him, what kind of mood he was in (usually grumpy), and tiptoeing around so as not to set off an explosion with him. He was in control and I didn't even realize it. I was afraid of him, afraid to correct him. He is better when I take command and control because it is actually scary for a kid who is out of control to know his parents aren't in control either. They actually want you to be in control. The one important thing I remember from the cd is when they start to get ugly and try to pick a fight, you "disconnect". You say in a frank businesslike tone, " Don't talk to me like that. I don't like it." and then you walk away and don't respond to their continued efforts to pull you into an argument. I couldn't believe it. It actually worked! You are in control because you are refusing to allow the situation to escalate and you end it! Once he called me on my cell phone to complain and pester me to death that there wasn't any barbecue sauce, why didn't I get bbq sauce at the store, "you always forget stuff", "you know I can't eat this without bbq sauce," you get the picture.... I said over the phone in a calm voice, "There is no BBQ sauce. I have to go now. Bye,bye." and I hung up. I thought for sure he was going to keep calling me and calling me, but he didn't! I assumed control and he perceived me as being in control.

 

Hope this helps...the main thing is you are not alone. Also, his age may be a factor. I've read that ages 10-12 is generally a bad time. I can say that things were the worst so far when my son was 11. It's not a picnic now, but it is not as bad as when he was 11. Supposedly, after puberty things get better. My brother has TS also and he is 31 now. He acted the same way as my son does at that age. I remember those nasty, irritable moods.... That did get better.