Bontech vitamins -- help!

[Rick43]

Rick

 

my son finds nightly epsom salts tubs, or when no time for a tub, a footbath, very important! he is already 21yo and been doing this for years.

 

also, have you looked at the article on tic triggers on the main page here? The lists of triggers are near the bottom

http://www.latitudes...ng_triggers.htm

 

Sheila's book may be helpful to you as well

http://www.latitudes.org/book.html

 

stress is #1 on my son's list of triggers. He has found the aromatherapy of jasmine oil one of the fastest "instant" soothing things. We read about research on this, and got him a bottle of jasmine oil (we got the one by NOW) and he either just smells it from the bottle or puts a drop on each wrist and smells on that as needed.

 

another helpful thing (if you aren't allergic to any of the flowers in it) is a few drops of Bach's Rescue Remedy under the tongue for calming when feeling stressed

 

think outside the box re what could have triggered you this weekend

 

did you mow the lawn? have contact with pesticides/fertilizers? go anywhere with lots of fluorescent lights or flashing stuff...eg movies

any paint work or woodwork done?

 

Thanks for your reply Chemar!

 

I have reviewed that list, and also we have purchased the book you refer to. I'm still reading it, as I find myself looking through it for ideas, so still have a ways to go.

 

hmmm, nothing seems to stand out in terms of triggers, just yet, when I look at that list I copied below. I am using some (not much) unrefined sugar on oatmeal in the morning, but that's about it. I was worried that it was the blueberries I was eating in a smoothie with organic rice milk, so I cut that out. I didn't see blueberries mentioned as a trigger, so I hoped that was safe. Same with the tomatoes.

 

I asked my wife to help me go through your list of supplements your son was using earlier and now (since we have written down both lists). I'm mainly just on Bontech as my starting point (TS-plus control, TS-plus EPA/DHA, TS-plus Grape-X, TS-plus mag-taurate), and when we look at Tic reducers, it appears I should also add:

 

(natural Calm, a cal/mag/zinc supp, epsom salts baths, footbaths, soaked cloth application, in addition to dietary magnesium intake)

* taurine (main tic reducer)

note: I just added L-carnitine today for the first time (as I am having bad vocal tics as well), but noted that you said it made your son edgy, so may discontinue if I see an issue.

 

Thanks for your great tips. I will order the jasmine oil and bach's rescue remedy today. If stress is an issue, I want to reduce that, as I know that sets me off. I just didn't think I was stressed over the weekend.

 

Rick

 

Most Common (in alphabetical order):

 

Alcohol

Artificial colors and flavors

Cleaning chemicals

Caffeine

Chocolate

Dairy

Dust

Excitement

Infections (bacterial/viral)

Molds

Perfumes/scented products

Pollens

Preservatives/MSG

Stimulant medication

Stress

Sweets/sodas/cane sugar

[Chemar]

Rick my son eats blueberries daily with his oatmeal and no, has found them to only be helpful, never a trigger

 

I am not sure of the salicylate content of tomatoes but do know some people with tics find salicylate high foods to be triggers

[Rick43]

Rick my son eats blueberries daily with his oatmeal and no, has found them to only be helpful, never a trigger

 

I am not sure of the salicylate content of tomatoes but do know some people with tics find salicylate high foods to be triggers

 

wonderful -- I really missed the blueberries. I tried searching on the internet about Salicylate in tomatoes, but don't see anything so far.

 

my wife compiled a list of what triggers your son, and what he can eat from your links you sent us.. so we had it in one place. hopefully we captured it correctly.

 

I may not exactly know what "organic animal proteins" means, but I think this means meat, dairy, and eggs - but doesn't seem to match the remainder of your list. Also, I don't speciifically see Soy called out as a trigger, or a fodd he eats, so wanted to ask if that is an issue - as I'd love to add back in soy if I can.

 

RICK

 

From Cheri's links:

 

Triggers were:

Artificial foods

Colorings

Sweeteners

High fructose corn syrup

MSG

Grapes

Pineapples

Corn

Potatoes

Pesticides

Chlorine

Mold

 

 

Ate:

Omegas--flaxseed oils

Brown rice

Quinoa

Vegetables

Salads

Fruits

Organic animal protein

Healthy fish

Garlic, ginger, turmeric

Rice or apple cider vinegar

plain yogurt used instead of milk for cereals, and in sauces instead of

cheese or dairy,

wheat free miso /soy products,

coconut milk and oil and spread,

green tea, pure chai,

some pure fruit juices,

lots of reverse osmosis water

[Chemar]

hmmm not sure where you would have found me saying "organic animal protein"? as it is not a term I think I have used?, but yes, to me it indicates organic chicken, beef , lamb.

 

only wild caught fish NEVER farmed fish

 

my son used to eat soy products but now avoids them totally as the genetically modified soy, as with corn, is a problem

 

the Feingold website lists foods that are high in salicylates as those are avoided on that diet so you may find info there

[Rick43]

hmmm not sure where you would have found me saying "organic animal protein"? as it is not a term I think I have used?, but yes, to me it indicates organic chicken, beef , lamb.

 

only wild caught fish NEVER farmed fish

 

my son used to eat soy products but now avoids them totally as the genetically modified soy, as with corn, is a problem

 

the Feingold website lists foods that are high in salicylates as those are avoided on that diet so you may find info there

 

Thanks Cheri. I will check out that site for salicylates.

 

I will update my internal list based on your son's diet and replace "organic animal protein" as you stated. I will also note that he doesn't eat dairy or soy. AS you can tell, I'm using this as a baseline for building up my diet plan.

 

Do you think your son would have had an issue with organic soy if he chose to eat it (ie, since I believe it's not genetically modified?)

 

You are so helpful -- I want you to know again how much I appreciate all this help.

 

Rick

[Chemar]

Rick, do remember that since 2006 my son has also had a Crohn's diagnosis, and so a lot of his diet and supps are tweaked to accommodate that extra health challenge. As far as tics & OCD go, he finds it best to avoid anything specifically dopaminergic, and avoids all the artificial everythings totally as they are his primary tic triggers

 

the food elimination has been far more related to the Crohn's for him. He does not have any natural food allergies as such, but has found much digestive benfit from going gluten and dairy free, plus eliminating all corn, and soy, and currently only eating wild caught fish, no other meat. Interestingly he does well on bananas, tho I know some people tic more on them. The key is their ripeness...over ripe fruit stimulates dopamine more we have heard, whereas the just ripe banana boosts serotonin, which is helpful in controlling OCD. He also likes cantaloupe and fresh limes for their high inositol levels(therefore also upping serotonin)

 

he did not have a problem with soy per se, and always used organic when possible. it was his personal choice to eliminate it, more re Crohn's than TS. However a number of others here have reported soy to be an allergen for them or their kids with TS

[Chemar]

ps in the later updates on my thread you will find other foods my son found best.

 

I noticed a "rice OR cider vinegar" in a list you attribute to me above?

 

my son can eat brown rice but not *OR* cider vinegar?? he used cider vinegar before as a yeast buster, and also for salad dressings etc. And ate rice daily

[Rick43]

ps in the later updates on my thread you will find other foods my son found best.

 

I noticed a "rice OR cider vinegar" in a list you attribute to me above?

 

my son can eat brown rice but not *OR* cider vinegar?? he used cider vinegar before as a yeast buster, and also for salad dressings etc. And ate rice daily

 

it looks like I need to go through your thread again as there were obviously a few mistakes made. Somehow my wife must have written down rice vinegar and cider vinegar - and instead, she should have written brown rice only.

 

by the way, I found that list of salicylate high foods from feingold (thought I'd post here) -- so maybe it was the tomatoes giving me tic issues.

 

Food Sources of Salicylates

Almonds, Apples, Apricots, Aspirin, Berries, Cherries, Cloves, Coffee, Cucumbers, Currants, Grapes, Nectarines, Oil of wintergreen, Oranges, Peaches, Peppers (bell & chilli), Pickles, Plums, Prunes, Raisins, Rose hips, Tangelos, Tangerines, Tea, Tomatoes

[Chemar]

Feingold is a good site. We have had members here see tics resolve by following that diet.

 

my son does not have salicylate sensitivity, but I know many have posted here of it

 

I am thinking the vinegar on the list may have been that my son uses either rice vinegar or cider vinegar, not grape vinegar!

 

but yes, brown rice filled the gap for him when he stopped eating potatoes. he definitely has night shade sensitivity as a tic trigger....which, come to think of it, TOMATOES are night shades too! (he doesnt eat them as they are not crohn's friendly)

 

maybe you are night shade family sensitive?

[Rick43]

Hmmm. That certainly could be it.

 

I looked at the feingold list above again and realized "berries" are on the list --- maybe the daily blueberry smoothie wasn't a good idea after all.

 

That is a bummer, as I really was hoping that one was ok.

 

This food elimination is definitely a bit of a challenge

 

Anyone else on this forum have issues specifically with berries? Or tomatoes? The salicylate list is pretty large.

[Chemar]

yes, I know my son would have struggled if he had to follow Feingold !

 

I am not fully informed on the subject but I know that people fall into under or over methylated (also relates to histamine) and that determines whether they have these salicylate food sensitivities (I hope I got that right !)

 

We did a lot of trial and error stuff with food and basically have learned that way what to include and what not. It is always a learning curve.

Best experiment with one food (or food group) at a time, eliminate (we were advised 3-4 weeks) and then re-introduce one at a time and chart reactions in terms of both neurology and digestions, plus general mood, well-being) removing offending foods immediately if a spike is noted when re-introducing them, and then try to stay off them completely

 

interestingly, even a little of an offender can cause a hyper-reaction to it when one has been off it for a while. this applies to the artificial ingredients too

 

btw, I noticed you had "sweeteners" on the list of no-nos for my son...that is only refined cane sugars and all artificial sweeteners(nutrasweet,aspartame), including "corn sugar" aka high fructose corn syrup HFCS and sucralose/Splenda

but

he derives much benefit from pure organic raw honey & maple syrup, which are not only his sweeteners, but also a vital part of his nutritional and anti-microbial program. He no longer uses cane sugar at all, by choice, although he used to be fine using the turbinado.

[Rick43]

yes, I know my son would have struggled if he had to follow Feingold !

 

I am not fully informed on the subject but I know that people fall into under or over methylated (also relates to histamine) and that determines whether they have these salicylate food sensitivities (I hope I got that right !)

 

We did a lot of trial and error stuff with food and basically have learned that way what to include and what not. It is always a learning curve.

Best experiment with one food (or food group) at a time, eliminate (we were advised 3-4 weeks) and then re-introduce one at a time and chart reactions in terms of both neurology and digestions, plus general mood, well-being) removing offending foods immediately if a spike is noted when re-introducing them, and then try to stay off them completely

 

interestingly, even a little of an offender can cause a hyper-reaction to it when one has been off it for a while. this applies to the artificial ingredients too

 

btw, I noticed you had "sweeteners" on the list of no-nos for my son...that is only refined cane sugars and all artificial sweeteners(nutrasweet,aspartame), including "corn sugar" aka high fructose corn syrup HFCS and sucralose/Splenda

but

he derives much benefit from pure organic raw honey & maple syrup, which are not only his sweeteners, but also a vital part of his nutritional and anti-microbial program. He no longer uses cane sugar at all, by choice, although he used to be fine using the turbinado.

 

 

Cheri,

 

Do you think the fact that I started this food elimination 8 days ago is potentially causing this severe tic (motor/vocal) reaction? I am on my 3rd day now of going absolutely crazy with tics. I didn't even go to work today (worked from home) as it is so bad right now. I was wondering if it's just because I made such a "cold-turkey" switch right when I started.

 

Either that, or one my foods I've been eating is just not working for me. I have been eating ONLY skinless/boneless chicken breasts with brown rice pasta or brown rice and steamed, fresh broccoli. The chicken is not organic, but says on it very clearly that it's "locally grown, always fresh, always natural with minimal processing and no preservatives/no additives." Other than that, it's been oatmeal, organic evaporated cane sugar, and organic rice milk and some "earth balance natural buttery spread". (I eliminated the organic tomatoes and blueberries 2 days ago). Decaf coffee in the AM, and that is it.

 

I can not think of any time of being around perfumes, pesticides, or even mold, dust or cleaning chemicals at all.

 

do any of these foods above seem like an issue?

 

lastly, to be clear, when you say you were advised 3-4 weeks, do you mean only add one new food or food group every 3-4 weeks? Wanted to confirm, as that will obviously take quite awhile if I'm adding blueberries on week 4, then not until week 8 do I add something like tomatoes.... and so on.

 

 

 

 

Thanks

Rick

[Chemar]

Hi Rick

yes, it is very possible that the sudden withdrawal of lots of what your usual diet was could be contributing. That is a very sparse diet you are on!

 

how long have you been on the Bontech now?

 

re the elimination, I know others do it differently but what I meant was 3-4 weeks of eliminating a specific food GROUP, then introduce it and you should know within a few days if it is ok or not, then eliminate a new food group for 3-4 wks and introduce etc

 

I dont know what is in the "buttery spread" so not sure if anything there could be a trigger, but the rest of your diet sounds good, albeit possibly lacking in some of the needed nutrients

 

presumably you have been ok with rice in the past?

[Rick43]

Hi Rick

yes, it is very possible that the sudden withdrawal of lots of what your usual diet was could be contributing. That is a very sparse diet you are on!

 

how long have you been on the Bontech now?

 

re the elimination, I know others do it differently but what I meant was 3-4 weeks of eliminating a specific food GROUP, then introduce it and you should know within a few days if it is ok or not, then eliminate a new food group for 3-4 wks and introduce etc

 

I dont know what is in the "buttery spread" so not sure if anything there could be a trigger, but the rest of your diet sounds good, albeit possibly lacking in some of the needed nutrients

 

presumably you have been ok with rice in the past?

 

Agree - it's very sparse. I did it that way because I was under the impression that the elimination diet meant cut down to the bare minimum and slowly introduce new foods and food groups. I would love to add foods, but feel I need to have tics under control first so I'll know if a new food sets me off.

 

the buttery spread we bought on purpose for this diet, as it was certified non-GMO, gluten free, lactose free, and vegan. It does however use expellar-pressed natural oil blend (soybean, palm fruit, canola, and olive oil) as it's first ingredient - and it does contain soy. I haven't used very much at all (2 tablespoons total), but clearly there is soy in it. I somehow missed that before.

 

I've no issue with rice in the past.

 

I would love to add needed nutrients via an expanded diet, and my goal has always been to expand the diet, but I just cant seem to get there tic wise.

 

Ohh, and as far as bontech goes, I've been on it for 3 months, and have been very careful to not miss a pill

(TS-plus control, TS-plus EPA/DHA, TS-plus Grape-X, TS-plus EPA/DHA, TS-plus mag taurate).

 

And just took my epsom salt bath.... (2 cups of epsom salt, 25 minute bath)

 

I don't understand what's making me go nuts here.

 

thanks,

Rick

[Chemar]

Agree - it's very sparse. I did it that way because I was under the impression that the elimination diet meant cut down to the bare minimum and slowly introduce new foods and food groups. I would love to add foods, but feel I need to have tics under control first so I'll know if a new food sets me off.

 

 

thanks,

Rick

 

An elimination diet (at least the way we were taught) is eliminating a specific food group for a period, and then reintroducing it to see results, not eliminating most food altogether! It is not too late to start over as right now you are in a waxing mode so setting a new baseline is not a bad idea

 

I hope the epsom baths relaxed you enough to give a peaceful night