Type of protein consumed... meat/grains

[CSP]

Hi all,

 

I'm looking for anyone who may have info on this. Am I to understand that protein from meat and grains are different types of protein? If so and one has an impaired protein synthesis does anyone know which protein one would be having a problem with?

 

I'm wondering if gluten proteins being the cause of sensitivity shown on the IGG tests, would be the logical protein to assume, is the protein synthesis problem.

 

Caryn/anyone?

 

thanks CP

[patty]

Hi CSP,

 

It has been awhile since you post. Is your son doing NAET or CST? If so, can you update us? As my son are doing both, your feedback is appreciated.

 

Thx!

 

Pat

[Caryn]

CP,

 

I'm not a biology major, but I will take a stab at it. Protein synthesis is when proteins are created by the body's cells. The body uses DNA, RNA and various enzymes to do it. I would assume that impaired protein synthesis is when the body is unable to produce these proteins adequately, perhaps due to lack of enzyme production?

 

We know that leaky gut and genetic predisposition can cause various enzyme deficiency issues. Maybe that is what is meant? Were you reading this somewhere in an article?

 

There are folks that are unable to digest protein of any kind. I don't know much about it or how common it is. I am not sure what the causes would be. As far as leaky gut/celiac, I know that initially many of these folks have a long list of foods they are unable to eat but eventually when their bodies heal they can resume many foods once prohibited due to digestive issues.

 

I am not sure how that relates to the term 'impaired protein synthesis' without seeing it in context. I did a quick google search and it appears like it is common among patients with alcoholism and I see that zinc deficiency can lead to impaired protein synthesis.

 

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=A...865313caf235854

 

So based on that information I would assume that the term has nothing to do with meat protein vs gluten protein in particular but with possible mineral deficiency and the need for enzymes in the diet possibly for proper protein synthesis.

 

Honestly, this is just a guess. I'm only taking a stab at it.

[CSP]

Hi,

 

Patty, My son is doing well because it was winter I guess. I will see how things go in the next few weeks. We stopped the NAET because it was so far and my son was stressing out about baseball being missed so we felt it was not worth it if it was going to upset him.

 

He is over all very healthy as of last Dr. appt. She feels he looks great, just makes lots of noises.

 

Caryn, I just found out grains were protein and I remembered my son has this impaired protein syn. and I was wondering if this could be connected. I guess I was wondering if undigested grain protein getting into the blood was somehow the reason for the protein problem. My son's test was hair tho, so I didn't know if that applied to the blood idea.

 

I was calling on you because I was trying to make the gluten connection and wondering if gluten was just an autoimmune reaction or could the gluten be in a broader sense an assaut on the digestion. I'm just really wondering why gluten free diets seem to help so many conditions. Does that make sense?

 

CP

[Caryn]

CP,

 

Folks that are gluten intolerant lack the ability to produce enzymes that will break down the protein in gluten and digest it properly in the body. From what I understand these undigested proteins float around the body reeking havoc over time as more and more gluten is ingested. Eventually this gluten protein makes its way to places it doesn't belong-- the skin (eczema), the blood stream (due to leaky gut), the tissues (achy joints), etc.... Some Celiacs say that it takes years for them to get rid of the gluten. Well, how do you know? most people would ask--

 

It is simple, the antibody levels at onset might be as high as 300 or more and it takes on average 2 years to reduce that number down to a normal level in most cases (less than 10).

 

Well, I know that according to Dr. Fine at Enterolab gluten intolerance is a lot more widespread than most docs think.

 

The nature of the toxicity, although to some extent stems directly from the chemical nature of gluten, is mostly due to a reaction that occurs by the immune system of individuals in possession of certain genes that recognize gluten for the foreign protein that it is and hence toxic. The immune system genes in control of this reaction are actually not rare, and may be present in up to 60% of Americans (based on my research). However, there are other, as of yet undetermined, genes that control whether or not a toxic reaction will occur, and further, whether and how much the reaction will result in damage to the intestine and other tissues. It is speculated that the structure of gluten may be similar to an infectious agent (for example a virus) and that is really why the gene is present in the immune system in the first place. It is even possible that the gene controlling reactivity to gluten is so common because millions of years ago it lent a survival advantage against dying from infections to those possessing it. Thus, having an immune system that recognizes gluten as a foreign, potentially toxic protein actually may be a sign of an immune system that is particularly sensitive and protective. Although this may portend protection against infections, the down side is that the same genes lead to more severe, longer lasting immune responses to foods, environmental allergens, and even the human body itself. The consequences of these reactions are food sensitivities (of which gluten sensitivity is just one), allergies/asthma, and autoimmune disease, respectively.

 

He is not alone in his theory that celiac is a regressive disease and a gluten free diet must be started before damage to the intestines occurs and a biopsy reveals sprue. Dr. Rodney Ford, a pediatric gastroenterologist from New Zealand has the same ideology. They think that when a patient has the genetic markers that they would do best to be gluten free before the damage occurs, rather than wait.

 

I think I agree now. Let me explain.

 

We have come up to our 2 year anniversary of going gluten free for our son who developed a chronic multifocal tic disorder at the age of 3 1/2. At the time of onset he was physically unwell, small for his age, anemic, behavioral, and ticcing all day long every day.

 

His tics lasted for four months chronically before we started natural treatments which included a low grain diet. It wasn't until Late April of 2007 that we went gluten free officially.

 

The first nine months were rough. If he even got a crumb of an exposure he would either puke for hours afterward or get explosive diarrhea. After about a year we saw a significant improvement in him healthwise. Now we are nearing the two year mark and just last week he ate a Dunkin Donut at school with the substitute teacher unknowingly served him one. (he later reasoned that it was okay because it didn't have any labels on it.) Such convenient logic.

 

Anyway, the thing is, he had NO OBVIOUS SYMPTOMS. I was shocked. I thought he would have an upset tummy, problems in the intestines, at the very least an increase in tics. He was in a wicked mood that afternoon and did not have a normal bowel movement afterward. That was it.

 

I called Enterolab and inquired. I learned quite a bit. Apparently this is common for a recovered Celiac. Some can go 5 to 7 years symptom free and occasionally eating wheat. The problem is, they still lack the gene that produces the enzyme necessary to digest the gluten so they WILL get sick again once that undigested protein starts to accumulate again and the antibody levels begin to rise. It is just a matter of time. We have just ordered our follow up stool test to see how low the antibody levels have gone since onset. I am hopeful that they have reduced down to next to nothing, based on his reaction to the donut. The key is to keep the antibody levels low and the only way to do that is to stay committed to the diet 100%. Dr. Fine's office explained that eating a donut one time is not going to spike the antibody level in the immediate, that it is a slowly rising and slowly falling process. Folks starting a gluten free diet based on lab tests need to take this into consideration. Improvement could take weeks, months. Once the antibody levels are down, in my experience the symptoms go way down-- digestive and neurological. This has been our personal experience. I have no solid scientific data to prove that.

 

I did inquire about enzyme use in lieu of a gluten free diet and was told that it isn't foolproof. It may slow down the process but will not stop it, as it can't--

 

Caryn

[dee45]

It just a stool test or a blood test as well to determing whether someone is intolerant to gluten??

 

Deanna

[Caryn]

Both.

The stool test is more sensitive.

If we did the blood test now it would show a negative because he has been gluten free so long. This is why Dr. Fine suggests the stool test for recovering Celiacs.

[CSP]

Ahhh, I get it.

 

Thank you Caryn that was helpful.

 

My son's Intergrative Dr's. practice has become very big here, and she has her husband joining the practice because the waiting list is so long. I have told a lot of friends to see them and every time I talk to them after their visit with the Dr. they have been told to go gluten free.

 

The list is long from Celiac, ulcerative colitis, asthma, and neurological disorders. These Drs are a gluten free family, and really believe in not eating gluten. They don't pressure tho very nice, really want you to make the choice.

 

Thanks again, CP