Phenylalanine

[kim]

Cheri,

 

I'm wondering if your son used the D form of phenylalanine only? You're right about the DL form being much easier to find.

 

I didn't remember ever reading that info on the "treatments that helped your son," post. I was looking at it recently when my oldest was in the midst of the head shaking flair. Since he's older now, it's easier for him to articulate what he's feeling. That tic was clearly done to induce pain. We didn't end up using Phenylalanine, because the problem went away before we tried it with just getting back to a cleaner diet and back to the supplements that we have been using over the past 3 years. I do want to keep this in the arsenol of things to consider in the future if needed though. Those pain inducing tics are awful!

 

The power of some of these supplements is really awesome. I was reminded of that as we were working through the head shaking. I did feel that the 5HTP was beneficial. Maybe the serotonin boost (we used conservative amts thru out the day) helped in the same way that the phenylalanine would have?

 

Also, I'm wondering if you can comment on why you are more comfortable with tryptophan than 5 HTP?

 

I want to quote this from your post here especially for newer members or just as a reminder.

 

I stress again,ESPECIALLY if you are ON MEDS, it is a good idea to talk to a physician before adding or combining some of these supplements as interactions can occur which can be serious.

[Chemar]

Hi Kim

yes, we used the pure D form of phenylalanine under doctor supervision when my son's tics and OCD merged to cause self injury. It was short term and very effective. It boosts endorphins. We ordered it online here

 

I must stress again that phenylalanine can increase tics in people with TS and that the DL or L forms are not advisable for this reason. The D form is specifically used for pain relief and endorphin production and should only be used short term

 

 

I cant recall ever saying I was more comfortable with tryptophan than 5HTP, as when my son was using 5HTP, tryptophan was still not available, which it now is. However, now that pure tryptophan is available, it would appear that it is a better choice than 5HTP only because one step in the process to increasing serotonin is therefore eliminated and so a faster result achieved

[kim]

Thanks Cheri

 

I book marked that site.

 

About the 5HTP/tryptophan, I think your remark was more something like you just said, as in now that tryptophan was available again it was a better choice in your opinion?

 

I think my confusion was in thinking that 5HTP converted to tryptophan, but after doing some reading, looks like tryptophan converts to 5HTP then to serotonin. one site said tryptophan converts to serotonin (no mention of 5HTP intermediate) so I guess what i should focus on, is just how my son responded to it.

 

The one thing i can say for sure, with our limited use of this supplement (5HTP) it surely did promote sleep! I don't need any further studies to convince me of that.

We had to use very small amounts to avoid the sleepies.

 

Here are a few sites for anyone wanting info. The first/second is promoting a product, but seems to have some good balanced info.

The third made a good case for tryptophane as opposed to 5HTP

 

http://www.raysahelian.com/tryptophan.html

 

http://www.raysahelian.com/5-htp.html

 

Biochemistry of 5-HTP

Tryptophan converts to 5-HTP which converts to serotonin, then to N-acetyl-serotonin, followed by the conversion to melatonin. Note: Tryptophan is also metabolized by a different pathway, not all of it is converted into 5-HTP. Once serotonin is made, the pineal gland is able to convert it at night into melatonin, the sleep-inducing hormone. Vitamin B6 is involved in the process of serotonin formation. Tryptophan, 5-HTP, and melatonin are available for sale as supplements.

 

http://www.compoundingonoxford.com.au/subc...phan/index.html

[Chemar]

Hi Kim

I am real rusty on this as it has been years since my son used 5HTP

 

according to saved info on why tryptophan is better than 5HTP, it is said that "L-tryptophan is used in other metabolic pathways where 5-HTP is not be used".

some suggest that to get the maximum benefits one may want to supplement with both Pure L-Tryptophan and 5-HTP, because a "tryptophan deficiency cannot be corrected by 5-HTP alone".

 

I know mrsD and others have posted on other forums that they could not tolerate 5HTP but that tryptophan worked well for their depression and insomnia

 

 

this is the metabolic diagram on Wiki that shows that 5HTP is indeed a metabolite of tryptophan

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Tryptophan_metabolism.png

[kim]

Regarding the recent discussion of Phenylalanine and pain inducing tics, I thought this was quite interesting. Look at the compostition of L-DOPA

 

Neurophysiologic study of central pain in patients with Parkinson disease.

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18056580?dopt=Abstract

 

CONCLUSION: Conduction along peripheral and central pain pathways is normal in patients with Parkinson disease with or without primary central pain. However, apart from signs of hyperalgesia, our patients exhibited lack of habituation of sympathetic sudomotor responses to repetitive pain stimuli, suggesting an abnormal control of the effects of pain inputs on autonomic centers. Abnormalities were attenuated by l-dopa, suggesting that the dysfunction may occur in dopamine-dependent centers regulating both autonomic function and inhibitory modulation of pain inputs.

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levodopa

 

Levodopa (INN) or L-DOPA (3,4-dihydroxy-L-phenylalanine