Biofims question

[kmom]

Are biofilms same as cystic form of Lyme or are they separate issues?

[JTs-Mom]

Separate issues. Biofilms are a slimy coating that bacteria can form to protect colonies. Biofilms often contain many types of microbes... bacteria, funguses, protozoas, etc. They all live happily together under the protection of a biofilm. Cysts are a particular form of the bacteria that occur typicially when the bacteria is exposed to adverse conditions (e.g. antibiotics). Bacteria such as borrelia will curl up into a round form which makes it much less suceptible to antibiotics. This transformation can occur quite rapidly. Here are two links that explain these concepts...

 

http://biofilmbook.hypertextbookshop.com/public_version/contents/chapters/chapter001/section001/green/page001.html

 

http://www.stcatherines.chsli.org/lifecyclepaper.pdf

[lismom]

I was just looking this up this morning! We started grapefruit seed extract and was hoping it would take care of possible biofilm and cyst form. Didn't look like it but not done looking into this. Hope someone has info. Kathy

[MichaelTampa]

For biofilms, enzymes are good, like zyactinase, nattokinase, and lumbrokinase. Detoxing heavy metals is important too as part of that picture.

[Fixit]

For biofilms, enzymes are good, like zyactinase, nattokinase, and lumbrokinase. Detoxing heavy metals is important too as part of that picture.

 

 

Are these digestive enzymes....

and how do you dose...before each meal?

[Suzan]

I found this article helpful for some initial information.

 

http://www.wellsphere.com/lyme-disease-article/getting-rid-of-gut-biofilm-and-the-critters-it-protects/420746

[kmom]

Thanks everyone! The info helps!

[MichaelTampa]

For biofilms, enzymes are good, like zyactinase, nattokinase, and lumbrokinase. Detoxing heavy metals is important too as part of that picture.

 

 

Are these digestive enzymes....

and how do you dose...before each meal?

 

 

Well, they are both enzymes, so similar I guess. But, no, not the same as digestive enzymes, these really function as breaking up the biofilm rather than breaking up the food. Generally better to do these on empty stomach, half hour before breakfast, or bedtime, or mid-afternoon, to avoid the food getting in the way.

[lismom]

For biofilms, enzymes are good, like zyactinase, nattokinase, and lumbrokinase. Detoxing heavy metals is important too as part of that picture.

 

 

Are these digestive enzymes....

and how do you dose...before each meal?

 

 

Well, they are both enzymes, so similar I guess. But, no, not the same as digestive enzymes, these really function as breaking up the biofilm rather than breaking up the food. Generally better to do these on empty stomach, half hour before breakfast, or bedtime, or mid-afternoon, to avoid the food getting in the way.

 

Is this something that is generally addressed? Just in case? And how do you decide whether to treat or not? thanks, kathy

Edited January 31, 2011 by lismom

[MichaelTampa]

I don't know that everyone does address it. Some just go to LLMD's and some of those tend to focus on the abx. But, reality is, if you have chronic lyme, you have biofilm, and it makes sense to address it at the same time. Without addressing it, it's just harder for the heavy metal detox to work and harder for the abx to work. In some cases, perhaps it could be the difference between successful treatment or not, but it will at least affect how long it will take to treat.

[Bill]

I don't know that everyone does address it. Some just go to LLMD's and some of those tend to focus on the abx. But, reality is, if you have chronic lyme, you have biofilm, and it makes sense to address it at the same time. Without addressing it, it's just harder for the heavy metal detox to work and harder for the abx to work. In some cases, perhaps it could be the difference between successful treatment or not, but it will at least affect how long it will take to treat.

 

 

What is the standard protocol? As an experiment, I tried:

 

Nattokinase 36mg X 1 (Sat. night/Sun morning)

Lumbrokinase 20mg X 1 (Sat. night/Sun morning)

EDTA 500 mg X 1 (Sat. night/Sun morning) I think this was 30 minutes after the two enzymes.

 

one weekend (should say, gave my son). I like to try things on the weekend just in case. He felt sick to his stomach on the first dose. I only got him to take the second by promising we would wait a month before trying again. He was fine on the second dose....I am hesitant to give the EDTA too long though as I read one has to be careful and provide supplements to replace essential minerals it removes. He's on enough right now so I'll probably wait until we can talk to the doctor.

[MichaelTampa]

I don't know what standard is. In the beginning, some I would take twice a day, but it quickly went down to one per day of each of the pills I had. I think I took them for about a month or so. I think needs will vary quite a bit by individual situation. I do remember that occasionally early morning these pills would make me quite nauseous.