rowingmom

For DD13, previously asymptomatic for babesia, babesia treatment (specifically with the herb cryptolepis) brought about the symptoms of chest pressure, air hunger, sighing, dry cough and large muscle (thigh) pain/fatigue as a herx reaction. We had never seen symptoms of leg muscle pain, muscle fatigue or muscle weakness before the die-off reaction created by this particular herb used to treat protozoan infection. DD's leg pain was all (shin) bone pain associated with bartonella. The antibiotic malarone, which is also used to treat protozoan infections, did not cause any die-off reaction for DD. Reducing the dosage of the herb resolved the reaction within 24 hours. I would immediately stop whatever treatment you are using to see if symptoms resolve. If they do, and you can assure yourself that this is a herx reaction (ie mostly an increase of previous symptoms) and not an intolerance/allergic reaction to the treatment, reinitiate at 1/8 to 1/4 of the dosage you are now using and be vigilant for increased symptoms. If you see an increase in symptoms, decrease dosage. If they do not resolve, I would second 911rn's suggestion and head to the hospital, fully understanding that they will ask you what caused the symptoms in the first place. Herxing is hard on the body and is not necessary, other than to indicate that treatment dosages are too high and need to be decreased.

If infection is causing inflammation and the steroid is decreasing inflammation you would see a masking/decrease in symptoms, but not resolution of infection. How long it would take the infection to proliferate would depend on the infection. Most infections cause inflammation as endo/exotoxins are released (initiating cytokine cascades which trigger further immune response). This can be caused either by abx treatment or by the innate immune system itself.

Lyme infection is not a prerequisite for bartonella, babesia, anaplasma, ehrlichia etc. They can be stand alone infections.

"What could be the cause of my son's inflammation if he does not have an active infection? Last we tested, all his titres were back to normal." Titers of what? You have checked titers of everything?

I am now consulting with Julie on Buhner's bartonella and babesia protocols. When we weaned abx our LLMD admitted she knew little about herbal treatments, other than the canned Byron White and Cowden protocol tinctures that she sold. She didn't know much about those either, and because neither BW or Cowden worked for us I decided to use Buhner. Before contacting Julie I would advise purchasing and reading the books: Herbal Antivirals: Natural Remedies for Emerging & Resistant Viral Infections By Stephen Harrod Buhner Healing Lyme Disease Coinfections: Complementary and Holistic Treatments for Bartonella and Mycoplasma By Stephen Harrod Buhner Herbal Antibiotics, 2nd Edition: Natural Alternatives for Treating Drug-resistant Bacteria By Stephen Harrod Buhner And reading and understanding the coinfections protocols listed on Buhner's website. In the books there is a large amount of information on the infections, how and why the bacteria/protozoa cause the damage they do, and why Buhner recommends the herbs he does. They also explain herbal preparation, which preparations are better for certain infections and have recommendations on trusted sources. You need to have a rudimentary understanding of treatment before you begin, or you will be wasting your time and Julie's. Because she is Buhner's associate, she doesn't stray far from the recommendations in the books, so you will lose nothing by reading and being prepared. I actually had DD up and running with the bartonella protocol before our first consult. It was quick and I had few questions. Julie did give me a couple of suggestions for brain inflammation not contained in the bartonella protocol but I didn't use them because by that time DD was holding her own and didn't need the extra anti-inflammatory support. Julie was more help to us when I added babesia herbs to our protocol (I did this myself, it wasn't a suggestion from Julie) resulting in a babesia herx and then a subsequent clinical diagnosis by our LLMD for babesia infection; although DD had previously tested negative for both microti and duncani through Igenex. I wasn't comfortable treating babesia simply from the protocol listed on the website and wanted more information. Buhner's babesia/ehrlichia/anaplasma coinfection book should be out next spring. But in the meantime we continue consulting with Julie. Natural Treatments for Lyme Coinfections: Anaplasma, Babesia, and Ehrlichia By Stephen Harrod Buhner Julie appreciates the Excel charts (symptom vs protocol) that I record in daily (THANKS LLM!). If you want a template just ask. It makes protocol responses and herxes very understandable - much easier to communicate than if done verbally from written notes. DD wasn't looking the best when weaned from abx. Her stomach wasn't too bad because we have always supplemented with probiotics and fermented vegetables, but she was pale and not completely healthy looking. She is responding more naturally to herbs and looks better; more vigorous now, although we continue with probiotics as the herbs Buhner uses are very broadly antimicrobial (especially the babesia/protozoa herbs). If Julie is busy, which is happening more these days, Buhner has a few other consultants listed on his facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/stephen.buhner 1) I no longer see clients for herbal consultations. I recommend the following people: Julie McIntyre in Silver City, New Mexico (Julie@gaianstudies.org); 2) Tommy Priester in Lincoln, MA (tommy@hmithpy.com); Gordon Medical Associates in Santa Rosa, CA ((707) 575-5180); and Tim Sc...ott in Brattleboro, VT (Toll free: 877.591.1874 In VT: 802.246.1090) 2) In the EU/UK try: Peter Conway The WellSpring Clinic 1 Clanricarde Gardens Tunbridge Wells Kent TN1 1PE www.conwayherbalist.co.uk Peter Conway <herbalist1@mac.com> Landline from UK 01892676214 or mobile 07973417553 3) I do not sell herbs or protocols. I recommend woodlandessence.com; sagewomanherbs.com; elkmountainherbs.com; 1stchineseherbs.com; greendragonbotanicals.com, and MontanaFarmacy.com. 4. Herb companies In Canada (they also ship to the EU, as do some of the US companies but they have an easier time of it): Herbies-Herbs.com; and monteagleherbs.com. (Jef Victor Juel Martinussen, via facebook, may be useful for herbs in the EU, try him.) (NOTE: He posted on my timeline about a more direct route to contact him but I am having no success searching the timeline for the information. . . facebook is well facebook.)

When DD13 couldn't maintain improvements after 2 years of abx for bartonella our LLMD decided to trial malarone in case babesia was involved; even though all tests for babesia had been negative. We saw almost instantaneous improvements in ADHD/cognitive/executive function with this drug, but no further improvement of residual bartonella symptoms (shin pain, ticcing, some headache). The improvements didn't last however after malarone was withdrawn. It wasn't until we introduced the herbal combination CSA (cryptolepis/sida/alchornea) that we saw resolution of ADHD/cognitive/executive function as well as resolution of the remaining bartonella symptoms as well. Don't sell herbals short. They have worked for us, and although DD remains on low doses of Buhner's bartonella and babesia protocols, she is asymptomatic (even with significant exertion and with viral infections) which is good enough for me. We haven't used artemisinin so I can't comment on that one other than to say that although Buhner does recommend the herb for protozoan infections, he suggests it not be used for more than 30 days at a time.

Fatigue was one of DD's significant symptoms. Bartonella infection was responsible.

cara615 - keep the intuition going. Tell Bradstreet. He did well starting you on Bravo, but my feeling is that while probiotics are good for helping to keep you well, they may not be sufficient to overcome chronic undiagnosed infection. Have you investigated coinfections yet? Bartonella and yeast/mold were responsible for DD's ticcing. Keep looking. You will find the answer.

I am sorry. I know you have worked so hard on this. Perhaps you are still dealing with an infection that antibiotic monotherapy won't address.

Ticcing was one of DD's first physical symptoms. It appeared within 1 month of her MMR booster and an unidentified insect bite with atypical non-EM rash.

That's a start, and some are beginning to understand that our bodies can't withstand the constant barrage of toxins and immune disruptors we are eating and injecting ourselves with. But too many people assume genetic modification is done simply to increase nutrient content, size, palatability, crop yield etc. They have no idea that crops are genetically modified to withstand the toxins that are sprayed on them and that we eventually eat. Why are there "Keep Off, Poison" signs posted in yards and grassy areas sprayed for weed control with glyphosate and 2,4-D; and yet the same chemicals can be sprayed on our food and sold in the grocery store with nary a peep.

In my opinion, eating conventionally (non-organic) will do nothing to help our compromised children. The amounts and types of toxins being applied to these foods continues to increase. http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/10/28/new-toxic-genetically-engineered-crops.aspx "the US Department of Agriculture (USDA) recently decided to deregulate Dow Chemical’s next-generation GE crops. These crops are not only resistant to glyphosate, but also carry resistance to toxins like 2,4-D, a component of Agent Orange, and Dicamba, which has been linked to non-Hodgkin’s lymphoma. The chemical 2,4-D and other herbicides of this class have also been linked to: Immune system cancers Parkinson’s disease Endocrine disruption Reproductive problems Then, on October 15, the US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) announced its final decision to register Enlist Duo—a new herbicide manufactured by Dow Chemical, to be used on corn and soybeans genetically engineered to tolerate both 2,4-D and glyphosate. This was the final barrier standing between this new generation of GE crops and their widespread commercialization." With glyphosate and the other pesticides used in conventional agriculture now being associated with suppression of cytochrome p450 enzymes, impairment in serum sulfate transport and vit D synthesis, the disruption of the biosynthesis of aromatic amino acids by gut bacteria, as well as the interactions of glyphosate with metals in the environment and in our bodies, we need to be aware of the potential negative impacts of the toxins we ingest. http://www.ag.ndsu.edu/cpr/plant-science/glyphosate-as-a-pre-harvest-aid-in-small-grains-07-17-14 http://www.mdpi.com/1099-4300/15/4/1416 http://nhrighttoknowgmo.org/BreakingNews/Glyphosate_II_Samsel-Seneff.pdf http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/10/19/cholesterol-sulfate.aspx http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/05/08/heavy-metals-glyphosate-health-effects.aspx

You are ..... the best possible decision maker for your child. You know your child better than any doctor, you see and follow symptom reactions better than any doctor, you likely know more about your child's illness than any one doctor, you care more about your child than any doctor, and you have a mother's instinct. As quannie47 mentioned, there is little likelihood that you will make a decision that is irreversible. Do what you think is best, if that doesn't work try something else. I know as a mother facing similar difficulties and feeling very overwhelmed by the task, what you are going though; as we all do to some extent. Keep researching, keep searching for informed opinions and keep trying. Never give up, no matter how many paradigms fall or how far you have to look outside the box of the mainstream.

I would stop dosing for a couple of days and then try again with 1 drop to see how it goes.

I agree with dcmom. A psychologist's letter on recommended accommodations for your child's specific difficulties, irrespective of presenting infection or autoimmune disorder, is what the school needs. They have no comprehension about the psychiatric effects of infection. Our ped psychologist was good enough to diagnose DD with Asperger's, Tourette's, ADHD and motor delay before she suggested probable PANDAS and we subsequently discovered lyme, bartonella and now babesia. It was with the above mentioned diagnoses that I approached the school for the IEP, not the lyme/coinfection test results.

Trinity - for us A-Bart caused nothing but herxing. After taking months to get to 20 drops BID (DD could never stand TID) and holding there for 6 months, A-Bart produced no healing that couldn't be attributed to the antibiotics DD was taking. I discontinued A-Bart when we weaned abx and tried to start it again about 4 months later. And found we were back to square 1 with bartonella herxing. Ticcing, shin pain, fatigue, headache with only 4 drops. To be fair our LLMD never prescribed any of the BW detox formulas (that perhaps need to be taken with A-Bart). You might call BW to see what they suggest. We have had far more healing with Buhner's herbs than we ever did with A-Bart and A-L (which by the way did nothing for DD. No herxing, no improvement either). We are asymptomatic with Buhner, but only herxed with BW.

Kim - not sure if you read The Institute of Science in Society, but there is plenty on DNA / RNA recombination caused by GMO manipulation there. You might be interested: http://www.i-sis.org.uk/index.php This doesn't only happen with the fetal cell lines contained in vaccinations.

I just posted a new topic on the disruption of Vitamin D activation and sulfate production by Glyphosate (RoundUp). I forgot to add the tag: cytochrome p450 to the title - can't change it now. http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/10/19/cholesterol-sulfate.aspx "Glyphosate disrupts cytochrome p450 enzymes. There are lots of them in the liver [where they] activate vitamin D. We have a vitamin D deficiency epidemic right now. I think a lot of it might be due to the fact that it's not getting activated in the liver because of the disruption from the glyphosate."

Another Seneff interview on the effects of glyphosate (RoundUp) on vitamin D and sulfate synthesis: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2014/10/19/cholesterol-sulfate.aspx "Glyphosate disrupts cytochrome p450 enzymes. There are lots of them in the liver [where they] activate vitamin D. We have a vitamin D deficiency epidemic right now. I think a lot of it might be due to the fact that it's not getting activated in the liver because of the disruption from the glyphosate." The eNOS, which is responsible for making cholesterol sulfate,1 is also a cytochrome p450enzyme. Therefore, it too is disrupted by glyphosate. One of the first things that happen when you ingest excessive amounts of glyphosate is something called disseminated intravascular coagulation (DIC), which means that the red blood cells coagulate your blood. The red blood cells fall apart from the exposure to glyphosate as a result of losing their cholesterol sulfate. Interestingly, the cholesterol sulfate also makes gelled water around the cell. I've previously interviewed Dr. Gerald Pollack, a biophysicist with the University of Washington, who is an expert on water. He calls this gel-like water EZ water (H2O3), which stands for exclusion zone. It's basically structured water, which is the type of water your cells are made of. Electrons end up inside the structured water, and they become mobile. When an oxygen gas molecule comes in, it will get hit by one of those electrons. When you add that to a sulfur molecule, you end up with sulfate. This is basically what eNOS does. It has a zinc atom inside, which has a positive charge. The zinc is an important catalyst in this process, so if you're zinc deficient, your sulfate pathway is also disrupted. Here, again, glyphosate exposure is a factor, as glyphosate causes zinc deficiency by chelating it out. In addition to all its other functions, the sulfate synthesis actually protects your body from the adverse effects of sun exposure. Unfortunately, many sunscreens contain aluminum nanoparticles – zinc oxide and titanium dioxide—and when you add aluminum to your skin, it interferes with the functioning of eNOS. "It gets into the eNOS and ruins it, because the aluminum will displace the iron in the heme group, which will make the eNOS not work," Dr. Seneff says. "Of course, that's going to cause trouble in the liver, too, because the heme is part of the cytochrome p450 enzymes, which have this heme group that contains iron inside this porphyrin ring. The aluminum messes that up." According to Dr. Seneff, exposure to glyphosate increases your risk of skin cancer via this mechanism. In a nutshell, there's a strong positive correlation between sunscreen usage and the rise in skin cancer, and Dr. Seneff believes this may be because the aluminum in the sunscreen in combination with glyphosate exposure through the food supply effectively prevents your body from detoxing.

I would definitely consult before starting. Cilantro was recommended to us by Buhner's associate Julie McIntyre. She also suggested using zeolite as a binder, but I am not happy with the amount of aluminum that can be present in zeolite, so opted for DE. Although Julie has not yet let us astray, so we may try zeolite at some point,

We use Flower Fairy organic cilantro tincture. I order it from TheCanadianVitaminShoppe. Do not use too much or you will mobilize too many metals at once. Make sure you are using a binder in the gut. We have been using food grade diatomaceous earth - 1tbsp 1x daily. Clays can be constipating so I mix the DE with the daily dose of psyllium. Not sure how this will go over with a younger child. DD will drink it, but she is 13.

I would agree with this. Herbs for bartonella kept DD steady at 80% after she weaned bartonella abx. Babesia herbs got her to 95% - we didn't know we were dealing with babesia because her Igenex duncani/microti tests returned negative. 3 drops of cilantro TID, with diatomaceous earth QD has gotten her to 99%. Cilantro/clays are often used for metal detoxing and we have found a big decrease in electrosensitivity since starting this protocol as well. DD's remaining 1% is a suggestible mouth tic. It only occurs when I ask. All other PANS/PANDAS, bartonella, lyme, babesia symptoms have resolved. Lyme is not often found on it's own, and the coinfections tests can return negative even if there is infection. This may be because the immune system isn't strong enough to produce significant antibodies to the infection, or because there are sub-species involved that are not being tested for.

Methylation is an important part of detoxing. Please go back through the archives and read LLM's posts regarding MTHFR and methylation. Many children who are ill have difficulties converting B vitamins into the methylated versions required for chemical reactions in the body. This is why so many of us use the methylated versions of B6 (P-5-P), B12 (sublingual methylB12) and folic acid (L-5-methyltetrahydrofolate). Magnesium (orally or as Epsom salt baths if your child can tolerate sulfates), is important as well. Google magnesium/detox. Fresh squeezed lemon juice with stevia is often used. BM's need to be occurring 1 or 2 times daily to help move toxins out. We use organic psyllium husks (all non-organic grains and legumes are dessicated with glyphosate or other pesticides to speed harvest). Proper gut microbiota are required for detoxing in the gut. That means a good combination probiotic and fermented vegetables. Liver support is important - we use milk thistle and curcumin, both of which support liver function.

J.J. Bradstreet, M.D.; J. El Dahr, M.D.; A. Anthony, M.B., Ph.D.; J.J. Kartzinel, M.D.; A.J.Wakefield, M.B. 2004. Journal of American Physicians and Surgeons Volume 9 Number 2 Summer 2004 Detection of Measles Virus Genomic RNA in Cerebrospinal Fluid of Three Children with Regressive Autism: a Report of Three Cases http://icdrc.org/documents/bradstreet.pdf

2.5 mg zinc citrate daily in a multimineral supplement (SISU Only Minerals) and an additional 15 mg Zinc citrate tablet on Mon, Wed, Fri. We don't megadose on anything.