Calicat Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 Hi everyone, Sorry, I'll give an update soon, but time is very tight at the moment, as I have somebody coming to my house shortly and it's a bit of a mess! Anyway, my question: My daughter was doing quite a bit better the past few days (vitamins, magnesium, no additives, etc.). Then I gave her a few sticks of raw rhubarb (with the tiniest bit of sugar) and within 5 or 10 minutes she was ticcing quite a lot more. She seemed like she couldn't get enough of the taste, and wanted more, more, more (but I said no after the third stick). Also became kind of defiant and annoying after 20 minutes or so. Rhubarb is not a regular part of our diet. What do you think? Is it high in salicylates (or whatever that word is)? Thanks in advance for your replies! Heidi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kkver Posted June 1, 2007 Report Share Posted June 1, 2007 I think i will stay away from it i just did a random search and found this on net. Used in chinese medicines and more Rhubarb leaves contain poisonous substances. Rhubarb leaf poisoning is most often caused by oxalic acid, a corrosive and nephrotoxic acid that is abundantly present in many plants. The LD50 (median lethal dose) for pure oxalic acid is predicted to be about 375 mg/kg body weight, or about 25 g for a 65 kg (~140 lb) human. While the oxalic acid content of rhubarb leaves can vary, it averages about 0.5%, so a rather unlikely five kilograms of the extremely sour leaves would have to be consumed to reach an LD50 dose. In the petioles, the amount of oxalic acid is much lower, especially when harvested before mid-June (in the northern hemisphere), but it is still enough to cause slightly rough teeth. The roots and stems are rich in anthraquinones, such as emodin and rhein. These substances are cathartic and laxative, which explains the sporadic abuse of Rhubarb as a slimming agent. Anthraquinones are yellow or orange and may colour the urine. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhubarb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faith Posted June 2, 2007 Report Share Posted June 2, 2007 Calicat, Interesting observation. (but could be coincidence) But, I'm one who kind of leans towards being intolerant of certain foods as a cause of some problems, although I don't know if that kind of intolerance causes immediate reaction. But, have you ever perused the book by Doris Rapp, "Is this your Child"? It deals with food and environmental allergies being possible causes for behavioral problems in some kids. You could probably find it in your library. How is she doing right now? Still ticcing more and the behavior? Brave enough to challenge the ruhbarb again in a few days? You never know, maybe this is something that does not agree with her. (ruhbarb is listed as moderate in salicylates). Faith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kim Posted June 2, 2007 Report Share Posted June 2, 2007 as Faith pointed out, moderate in salicylates. but high in oxalates. There has been a considerable amount of interest in oxalate in regards to GI conditions and Autism. Susan Owens has done a lot of reseach on this subject, and I read recently where Dr. Shaw from Great Plains Labs was speaking at a seminar on this. http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:5f02w...;cd=3&gl=us http://www.branwen.com/rowan/oxalate.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calicat Posted June 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted June 2, 2007 Hey guys, Thanks for all of your responses and ideas. Kkver, I knew about the rhubarb leaf being not so great, but it was of course only the stems we ate... I wonder how different they are? I will certainly not be feeding it again to my daughter any time soon! Faith, thanks for the book recommendation--I will definitely seek it out. Hope the library has it. You asked about how she did after a while. Well, basically it was non-stop ticcing until she fell asleep! I think by 1 1/2 hours after eating it, the ticcing was that way. Between throat, sniffs, and eyes (a bit), I'd say a tic every couple seconds. This was a marked change from the previous day (and the whole day leading up to the "rhubarb episode", as it shall hence be known), a day when her father said that she was doing the best he'd heard/seen since this started a month ago. By this morning, her tics were much reduced again. As for behaviour, she did not continue with the defiance, but became much more hyper than usual, and could barely stay on her chair during supper, and got very "silly" teasing our guest repeatedly. Am I willing to re-challange the raw rhubarb? Umm, I'm terrified! But I may try it one of these days (and then leave her with her father until bedtime!) Kim, thanks for the great information on oxalates; it was so helpful! I had no idea. I was intrigued by some of the things mentioned in the article... like excessive thirst and frequent urination being possible signs of an oxalate problem. That's been my daughter for many years! I will keep an eye on her oxalate consumption and if I notice a pattern, I may join that low oxalate diet yahoo group. Thanks again, everyone. I'll keep people posted on the oxalate issue and patterns I notice. Calicat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kim Posted June 6, 2007 Report Share Posted June 6, 2007 Calicat, I'll keep people posted on the oxalate issue and patterns I notice I would love to hear any thoughts or observations you come up with in this area. Also, wanted to mention the excessive thirst and urination have been something I have noticed with youngest son too. I'm always worried about him developing diabetes. He is drawn to salty crackers, french fries, pretzels etc. I never know if his thirst is excessive in light of that or not. Getting protein in him is another challenge. I was told to give him Pediasure, but when I compared it to Carnation instant breakfast, it didn't appear much different. He sucks one of those down so fast in the morning, it looks like he has been in the desert for days! He showed crystals in a urine test. Still don't know the significance of that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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