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help with herxing


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My ds 17 is on 5th week with rifampin (plus agumentin) with strange herxing like behavior.

He had mostly bad days with depression/weeping, sweats, and fainting spell on first 2weeks then his physical symptoms disappeared.

I am noticing that his strange depression/mood swing is continuing with less frequency. I would meet a wonderful, mature, well balanced, and caring teen for 2-3 days and then I would have some very bitter, full of resentments, and sad teenage next day(almost always in the evening).

We could switch to Levaquin but I don't want to trade one set of problem with another so I am asking you wise and experienced people for your opinion.

Can herxing come in an inconsistent wave length? Why is this happening mostly at night? Is it unusual to have only psychiatric symptom as herxing?

Thank you

pathfinder

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I am no expert by any means. But it seems like after starting Bartonella treatment at the end of March, my dd9 would get some extreme behavior/psych symptom that would intensify for 2-3 days, then decrease. So at first it was the rages that came back for t 2 - 3 days. Then they reduced significantly. Then a week or so later, hyperactivity set in - running around, flailing arms, etc., for 2 - 3 days. Then that decreased substantially. Then another week or so later, doom and gloom, nothing could make her happy...." That seems to have gone away for the most part, too. I'm thinking these were herxing episodes, but who knows for sure. Since the doom and gloom, we haven't had any major changes in behavior/personality. Her OCD seemed to be slowly improving through the course of all of this. We still have a ways to go on that front, but I think we're heading in the right direction (God I hope I'm not jinxing us).

 

She is on Zithromax and Bactrim. We give her fish oil, Culturelle and Saccho Boulardis. When she would go into the possible herxing, we also had her take Epsom Salt/Baking Soda baths and give her Activated Charcoal. I can't really say whether they helped or whether the herxing just passed on its own.

 

So long response for a short answer that I think it can come and go in 2 - 3 day increments.

 

Kara

 

My ds 17 is on 5th week with rifampin (plus agumentin) with strange herxing like behavior.

He had mostly bad days with depression/weeping, sweats, and fainting spell on first 2weeks then his physical symptoms disappeared.

I am noticing that his strange depression/mood swing is continuing with less frequency. I would meet a wonderful, mature, well balanced, and caring teen for 2-3 days and then I would have some very bitter, full of resentments, and sad teenage next day(almost always in the evening).

We could switch to Levaquin but I don't want to trade one set of problem with another so I am asking you wise and experienced people for your opinion.

Can herxing come in an inconsistent wave length? Why is this happening mostly at night? Is it unusual to have only psychiatric symptom as herxing?

Thank you

pathfinder

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My dd's worst symtpoms (OCD, but I think-pretty sure its herxing) are always at night. I hate it because that is when I'm also less patient. Hers seems fairly constant, well worse after Tindamax, but just begins to recover when its time to take more...but my own herxing cycles like that. I'll have several good days, then a bad one here and there, maybe once a week or so. For me, I get fevers, brain fog, my heels hurt more, etc. My daughter only gets worse ocd.

 

 

 

My ds 17 is on 5th week with rifampin (plus agumentin) with strange herxing like behavior.

He had mostly bad days with depression/weeping, sweats, and fainting spell on first 2weeks then his physical symptoms disappeared.

I am noticing that his strange depression/mood swing is continuing with less frequency. I would meet a wonderful, mature, well balanced, and caring teen for 2-3 days and then I would have some very bitter, full of resentments, and sad teenage next day(almost always in the evening).

We could switch to Levaquin but I don't want to trade one set of problem with another so I am asking you wise and experienced people for your opinion.

Can herxing come in an inconsistent wave length? Why is this happening mostly at night? Is it unusual to have only psychiatric symptom as herxing?

Thank you

pathfinder

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Yes, Yes, Yes.... The waves are probably reflective of how he is infected. Bartonella and Babesia have very short growth cycles of a week or less. Where Lyme is typically days 28 to 34 growth cycle. If there is multiple infections you would have multiple cycles and initially it may be hard to pick up on cycles. As they improve there are less infections/bacterial load and it gets a little easier to tell cycles. My son is also always a little more symptomatic at dinner/bed time.

 

I got to thinking about the night time worsening of symptoms.... Typically when I have a cold my symptoms are much worse early evening. This is what I found out about why colds/flus are worse at night.... and perhaps it applies to chronic infection as well.

 

"The main reason for cold and flu symptoms to worsen at night is due to cortisol levels in your body.

 

Cortisol is a hormone produced by the adrenal gland. It works on a 24 hour cycle where a person's highest level of cortisol is during the day- and lessens as the day ends. When your body has its highest level of cortisol (during the day) it actually effects T-cell growth, preventing the immune system to work at its full potential.

 

At night, cortisol levels drop, allowing the immune system to kick in. Believe it or not, you actually feel slightly worse when your immune system is hard at work. (ie. congestion is worse- this is because your body is actually breaking up the mucus, causing a worse sensation. The same applies to a worse cough, stuffier nose, etc.)"

 

-Wendy

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I am noticing that his strange depression/mood swing is continuing with less frequency. I would meet a wonderful, mature, well balanced, and caring teen for 2-3 days and then I would have some very bitter, full of resentments, and sad teenage next day(almost always in the evening).

Is it unusual to have only psychiatric symptom as herxing?

Thank you

pathfinder

 

i don't know the ins and outs of herxing, but we did have psychiatric symptoms only in reaction to an anti-viral.

 

ds has been seeing his current dr for a little more than a year. at first, he diagnosed multiple infections. sometimes, for appts, there were clear worsenings or examples of things going on. for the most part, i'd say it just seemed like a mixed bag -- good days and bad -- not so much rhyme or reason -- not 100% but 'okay'. a few months ago, i said he'd have a great couple of days and then back to his 'normal'. the dr commented that he thought it was a good thing that we were seeing the good days, not so much a bad thing that they weren't consistent.

 

at the time, i thought he just didn't get what i was meaning. in the past month or so, i do think my ds has been on an uphill swing -- better than i've seen before. so yes, it's hard to deal with when you have the good and you just want it to last -- but at least, you are seeing some days of that wonderful, well balanced son!

 

ds is only this past week back on that anti-viral so we're bracing for another wild ride -- hopefully, won't be so wild. i was surprised b/c i thought he was seeming better so it's hard to put them on something that can bring some wildness back -- but hopefully, this will kick it to the curb! i'm hoping that for you too!

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Thank you everyone

You guys are absolutely amazing.

I have regained the strength to forward after reading your posts.

My ds got back on his TSO today ( after 2 weeks break) and I am hopeful that Bartonella will be gone before he starts college on Sept.

I hate Pandas but I think I prefer pandas over Bartonella.

pathfinder

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My ds4 only seems to have psych symptoms with herxing episodes. Guessing that's what they are. About 2 days after Tindamax, it's awful...whiny, irritable, impulsive (grabbing at everything like a 2 year old), unable to focus, emotional lability and some fatigue. He's so impatient and emotional, I can't imagine how he's going to do any summer activities, like T-ball starting this week! And yes, just when we seem to come out of the Tindamax episode, time to take another pill. So frustrating and feel bad that he can participate in these activities! Keep telling myself, yes, this IS lyme/bartonella. So hard not to second guess.

 

darlene

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