Strange Injury

[Suzan]

dd9 is my dd who gets roving pain, burning pain, bodyaches and has had 2 instances where she could not walk for a week and then gets mysteriously better. Day before yesterday she was taking out a rubber band from her doll's hair and said it felt like something moved or popped in her forearm and it started hurting badly. We put ice on it and the next morning it hurt badly and was swollen. It's still swollen and hurting although doing better at various times of the day.

 

I imagine a trip to the doctor is needed if it's not getting better by tomorrow but I don't see our regular doctor doing anything more than ice and rest. I'm interested in hearing if anyone has any thoughts about this that aren't lyme related. I already know I need to get dd9 evaluated for lyme but I want to have all the info I can about what else might be causing this since our local doc won't do anything about the lyme. She's had her RA markers done and the tests for inflammation (ESR, CRP) in the past, all normal. HHV6 was the only thing that has come back elevated and she was on antivirals for that for 6 months.

 

Has anyone heard of anything like this happening with your pandas kids or any kid that rings a bell? Her movement was not anything that would hurt a normal 9 yr old. It is about 2 inches above her wrist on the inner side like in a line up from her thumb. Overall her pain has been much better.

 

What else should I test for? Could it all be just from PANDAS? Is Lyme the only other possibility for us to persue? Even our chiropractor is worried now because stuff like this just happens too often.

 

Susan

[Worried_Dad]

Our son's initial symptoms included migratory joint pain, muscle pain/weakness, difficulty walking. He was originally diagnosed with rheumatic fever, which attacks joints and connective tissue. Reactive arthritis is similar and can also be caused by strep (and other infections). Might be something along those lines for your ds?

[Megs_Mom]

Have you had her tested for Lupus (first test is simple blood test for ANA levels - check and see if she already had)? It does seem like a Lyme, Strep or Rheumatoid symptom. The only ped Rheum in NC is in Chapel Hill - had awful appt there. I hear the guy down in Emory is good (no clue how he feels about PANDAS) - and he is a Neurologist as well. Might be worth a referral request, as you can drive there.

[Suzan]

Thanks everyone, I think I have some direction now so I really appreciate your thoughts.

 

Meg's Mom, you reminded me that we have had her ANA level tested which did come back normal.

 

Worried Dad, your son's symptoms really do sound similar to my dd's but my dd has been checked for RF and they say she does not have it. I was worried about RF a lot but I keep hearing NO. Reactive Arthritis, I have not heard of this, I can google it but anything you can tell me?

 

Also, both my girls have documented gluten intolerance and possible, but non-confirmed celiac. I am searching to see if this can be caused by celiac as well. We are gluten free but maybe there is enough hidden gluten to be causing issues if celiac is an issue. I can't put them back on gluten to try to get positvie tests so I don't know what to do there.

 

I'll look at Reactivfe Arthritis more, check the celiac symptoms and talk to our doctors more about this and try to be more careful about any hidden gluten and look into lyme. I feel like we are strep free by now but who knows if any is lurking.

 

Susan

[kimballot]

Susan - what you are describing sounds to me like an actual muscle or tendon injury - perhaps a sprain or strain or tendonitis? I am wondering because, if you heard a "pop" and the swelling is 2 inches above the wrist, it is very likely that it is some type of damage to the soft tissue. I am not discounting the ideas of celiac or lyme or reactive arthritis. In fact, I sometimes wonder if our kids are more prone to things like tendonitis because they do have inflammation and that makes everything tighter and causes more rubbing and such (no articles to back this up or anything .... just my thinking). I think your idea of taking her to the regular doc if it is not better by tomorrow. True - he/She may not do more than ice or rest, but an ace wrap or a splint or something like that may be in order.... Then I would keep pursuing the inflammation stuff since this seems to be a recurrent problem.

[dut]

hi - maybe check out ganglion cyst... often on wrist but I think can be on forearms too

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ganglion_cyst

[momto2pandas]

Sounds to me like she might be having issues due to laxity of the connective tissues and joint hypermobility? Joint hypermobility is well known to occur with a lot of adult anxiety disorders, particularly those that start in childhood, and can cause injuries like these to be more common. At least in the psych department where I worked, everyone "knew" that the joint hypermobile set was also the autoimmune set. I have it myself, and because everything is more "lax" than it should be, weird injuries and muscle aches can happen and at times it can hurt to walk. A quick test - can she touch her thumb to her forearm (don't try this on the currently injured hand, try it on the other)? Is she very flexible? http://www.medicinenet.com/hypermobility_syndrome/article.htm

 

I've had good experience with physical therapists for this condition. One put me on a regimen of weight lifting to keep all of the muscles around the joints really toned, and that helped a ton - essentially completely. I've been lifting now for 20 years at some level (lately not muich), and I find that when I do stop lifting completely for a long time, I'm prone to more weird stuff like that; it's good motivation to stay in shape. When I was pregnant with my second, I had problems because the pregnancy hormones make one even more lax, and sometimes my hips/legs would just buckle under me (rarely, but it happened). I had a physical therapist who specialized in this and worked miracles with deep massage...can't complain, either, that my insurance company then paid for massage twice per week while I was pregnant She was from the Netherlands and said that joint hypermobility is much more recognized and treated there; she thought it was bizarre that people don't seem to recognize it much in the US.

[KeithandElizabeth]

Hi Susan:

 

I would definitely do the IGENEX lyme test as well as the coinfections and mycoplasma.

 

Please let us know how she is doing.

 

Elizabeth

[PhillyPA]

Does anyone in your family have Rheumatic Fever? I would feel comfortable ruling out RF if there is no family history of it. However, if you have a strong family history, I would be so bold to say that the doctors may be wrong.

[Suzan]

Does anyone in your family have Rheumatic Fever? I would feel comfortable ruling out RF if there is no family history of it. However, if you have a strong family history, I would be so bold to say that the doctors may be wrong.

 

No RF that I am aware of. I have had her evaluated for it though twice but so far they say no.

[Suzan]

Sounds to me like she might be having issues due to laxity of the connective tissues and joint hypermobility? Joint hypermobility is well known to occur with a lot of adult anxiety disorders, particularly those that start in childhood, and can cause injuries like these to be more common. At least in the psych department where I worked, everyone "knew" that the joint hypermobile set was also the autoimmune set. I have it myself, and because everything is more "lax" than it should be, weird injuries and muscle aches can happen and at times it can hurt to walk. A quick test - can she touch her thumb to her forearm (don't try this on the currently injured hand, try it on the other)? Is she very flexible? http://www.medicinenet.com/hypermobility_syndrome/article.htm

 

 

I've never heard of that either. She can get her thumb pretty close to her arm but can't touch it and also she seems very inflexible in most other ways. I'm making a list though to discuss with our doctors so I appreciate any thoughts!

 

susan