EAMOM

[myrose]

Just wondering if after all this time and all your research if by any chance you have concluded a difference in the signs of pandas and tic disorders or I guess TS??

Wishful thinking I am guessing but I will always check......

 

I know in Pandas you have what you call episodes,,,but with tics you have wax and wane......so this again is confusing to me.

 

One last thing....do Pandas have tics daily like a tic-disorder or only when having or should I say during an episode?

[Buster]

Just wondering if after all this time and all your research if by any chance you have concluded a difference in the signs of pandas and tic disorders or I guess TS??

 

See http://www.latitudes.org/forums/index.php?...amp;mode=linear

 

Kirvan and Cunningham have isolated 3 auto-antibodies that they believe separate TS, PANDAS and SC and have shown that CaM Kinase II activation is different between an exacerbation in PANDAS and tics/non-PANDAS OCD.

 

Singer was supposedly trying to replicate this study in his 2008 Pediatric paper, but was not successful. Looking at his criteria, it appears that he chose children with chronic tics (> 3 years without remission) rather than those with episodic OCD courses (i.e., I think his study was more about TS than about PANDAS).

 

I appreciate your question around waxing and waning and want to go back to Swedo's comment in her 2004 response to Kurlan that the episodic course of PANDAS is nothing like the unfortunate waxing and waning associated with TS or non-PANDAS OCD.

 

On the CYBOCS score, Kirvan, Cunningham, Swedo, ... were all seeing differences of 15 pts in severity on CYBOCS. Kurlan and Singer saw differences of 3 points mean -- i.e., a 5 to 1 difference. This, in my opinion, is the difference in episodic versus wax/wane.

 

If you have primarily tics, I don't know if the studies will be helpful. I haven't studied that area as much because the scariest part for us was our dd OCD. I'll check.

 

One last thing....do Pandas have tics daily like a tic-disorder or only when having or should I say during an episode?

 

An episode for us last 5 weeks from initial exacerbation. Behavioral changes the first 2 weeks, we then get a movement disorder around the 9th day, then a verbal tic (a grunt) on the 12-14th day. The behavioral items clear around this time but the tic and movement items remain. The movement disorder is a weird measurement ritual -- hard to describe but our daughter seems oblivious that it is happening. The verbal tic is the last to go so it's there a good 3 weeks before we notice its absence. This is what we mean by episodic -- a period of 4-5 weeks going from nothing to significant back to nothing. The height of an exacerbation is still small compared to where we were a year ago, but it's clear when she's in an exacerbation.

 

Regards,

 

Buster