can PANDAS kids really let you know when there's strep in the fami

[tylermom]

both my boys have tics but they are not officially dx'd with PANDAS although i'm 99% sure thats what they have. my youngest ds 4 y/o has strep right now. he just started on abx yesterday. my oldest ds has not had a tic in 3 months and today 3 different tics have come back....nose twitching, head jerking, eye's blinking. he told me this afternoon his throat was hurting a little bit and my oldest dd 8y/o says her throat is hurting. so i guess i now have 2 more with strep. i posted yesterday about how my youngest was having such good behaviors since he had started running fever and several of you had said when your PANDAS child is running a fever it's like a PANDAS vacation with the symptoms. now that my ds's fever has gone away the horrible behaviors are back. i'm hoping the meds with help the strep go away and his moods will get better. my question for you all is how is it that these kids with pandas can sense someone else having strep???

[peglem]

both my boys have tics but they are not officially dx'd with PANDAS although i'm 99% sure thats what they have. my youngest ds 4 y/o has strep right now. he just started on abx yesterday. my oldest ds has not had a tic in 3 months and today 3 different tics have come back....nose twitching, head jerking, eye's blinking. he told me this afternoon his throat was hurting a little bit and my oldest dd 8y/o says her throat is hurting. so i guess i now have 2 more with strep. i posted yesterday about how my youngest was having such good behaviors since he had started running fever and several of you had said when your PANDAS child is running a fever it's like a PANDAS vacation with the symptoms. now that my ds's fever has gone away the horrible behaviors are back. i'm hoping the meds with help the strep go away and his moods will get better. my question for you all is how is it that these kids with pandas can sense someone else having strep???

 

This is what I wrote to explain on another post:

Canary effect:

 

When somebody 1st gets an invader/infection- strep for instance, the immune system has to make antibodies "from scratch," meaning the circulating, undifferentiated immune cells have to investigate the new microbe and fashion "soldiers" to attack it effectively- according to proteins (antigens) it detects on the invader. It produces massive amounts of "soldiers," specific for that microbe (more or less- maybe different microbes presenting similar antigens) until it has eradicated the invader. Then, it stores some copies of the soldiers- to make attacking that microbe quicker and easier the next time it is detected in the body and to hopefully eradicate it before it can take hold and cause infection/damage.

In PANDAS, one or more of those soldiers is activating basal ganglia cells, causing neuropsychiatric symptions. So, upon just simple exposure to strepA- the immune system recognizes the invader and responds with an army of quickly replicated soldiers. This keeps your child from getting actually infected with strep- but increases the soldiers who can't tell the difference between the invader and your basal ganglia. So the neurological symptoms present, w/o an actual infection occurring. So, like the canary in the mine, showing that there are toxic gases, your child's behaviors show there is strep in the environment.

 

So, they really don't sense someone else having strep, they are responding to the exposure they get from being around someone with a strep infection.

[matis_mom]

my question for you all is how is it that these kids with pandas can sense someone else having strep???

They don't know it, but their immune system does! My son was acting up a couple of nights in a row, no one had ANY symtoms of strep. Took them all in, 3 with strep throat, 2 with ear infections (possible strep?). Sad as it is, at least I'm thankful now I know and can do something about it. If it wasn't for my little canary, I never would have guessed and they all would have gone untreated and possibly end up with PANDAS as well.

It is interesting they usually react BEFORE you see symptoms in the other children. I remember so clearly last fall we were at a Halloween party and my PANDAS ds was holding up the bathroom line because he was doing his OCD handwashing thing (which he hadn't done in a while), that was Saturday. Next day my daughter had a high fever and sore throat, confirmed strep on Monday!

I am not saying run to the doctor at the first increase in symptoms, you may have to wait a little so the culture comes back +. But if you notice a definite change, you better believe it, there's strep going around.

Like Peglem said, exposure wakes up the troops and calls in some more, but unfortunately, the troops are not very well trained

[sf_mom]

The simplest article I have found... Your child tries to mount a response, antibodies titers rise with or without full blown infection. We too can tell there is strep even in his classroom prior to anyone being diagnosed.

 

 

PANDAS is controversial in medical circles with some physicians questioning whether such extreme psychiatric symptoms can be triggered by strep antibodies. However, according to Dr. Swedo, there is little doubt that the body's efforts to fight the strep bacteria set off a chain of events leading to PANDAS symptoms. "The science is clear now," Swedo asserts. "We not only have a direct relationship between the anti-strep antibodies and the anti-neuronal antibodies, but also have demonstrated that the antibodies interact with receptors in the brain that could produce the symptoms observed."

 

Normally when the strep bacteria enter the body, they defend themselves by mimicking healthy cells and elude detection by the immune system. Using the stealth strategy, the strep bacteria create an infection. In response, the body naturally creates antibodies - cellular components designed to find the bacteria, bind with them and direct the immune system to destroy the bacteria. When this happens as designed, the antibodies find the strep bacteria and the immune system wins the battle.

 

However, antibodies are not terribly discriminating and sometimes cannot tell a streptococcus bacterium apart from a healthy cell. In some children, these antibodies pass into the brain and look for something to connect with. In PANDAS, the strep antibodies are unable to discriminate between strep and healthy brain cells. However, the union of strep antibody and neural tissue is not a match made in heaven. Recent research, reported last fall by University of Oklahoma researcher, Madeleine Cunningham, suggests that the antibodies connect with parts of the brain which regulate repetitive behaviors and movement, such as compulsions and tics. According to Dr. Swedo, such autoimmune actions may have the direct result of producing obsessions, compulsions and tics; and in addition, they might indirectly offset the critical balance of brain chemistry which regulates mood and emotion.

 

Compounding the problem is the durability of strep antibodies. They can remain on the prowl for a hook up weeks after the strep is gone. Subsequent infections or even colds can stimulate the immune system to produce more of the same kind of antibodies which the triggered the original symptoms. PANDAS children can then abruptly re-experience the same symptoms after a symptom-free span of time. Dr. Swedo explained, "We see a saw-toothed pattern of symptoms, extreme outbursts of behaviors for a brief period in response to the infections and then the child may be relatively symptom-free for a period of time."

 

 

 

http://www.christianpost.com/blogs/health/...c-09/index.html