Red gums

[Hopeny]

my 3 YO who has an immune problem (mannose binding lectin deficiency, related to the complement immune system), and Lyme (normal ASO, Myco etc) went to the dentist about 5 weeks ago and ever since has had red swollen gums all over. It is not sores. The dentist said it is something systemic and not related to the cleaning. She had cleaning before and this did not happen. However the timing is suspicious to me. I put her back on her cefdinir/zith Lyme cocktail. Her CBC was normal, RBC and Hematocrit a bit low. I am using some biotene mouthwash rubbing it on her gums at night and also got some cankersore gum stuff I started yesterday. Any ideas? It's so upsetting to see her mouth looking like that.

[sf_mom]

It seems like it might be some type of gum infection. Has the azith/cefdinir combo helped yet?

 

When we have any sign of sore throat, mouth sores, cold or flu circulating in our household I have my kids gargle with MMS, dunk their tooth brushes in the liquid and bath in it. Many ingest MMS for chronic infection but it can easily over oxidize the red blood cells and would caution against ingesting. Dr. K - 'Lyme' Dr. uses it along with many of his herbal remedies.... enema's, ingestion, bathing, gargling, etc. You can find some of his comments regarding MMS on Better Health Guy website, etc. It is strong stuff.

[Hopeny]

I haven't seen much change from the zith/cefdinir, she has been on it for a week. I expected it to clear up overnight but it did not sigh. I will look into MMS, thank you, its hard because she is so little I am afraid to use anything.

[LNN]

lysine helps me and my kids with canker sores, but given her age, this might be tough. I suppose you could open a capsule and rub some on her gums and it would get ingested that way but not sure if it has a taste. Baking soda also works well for canker sores and red gums and because it's salty, the kids don't mind the taste as it dissolves. Something about the baking soda changes the PH and helps healing. Sort of a folk remedy but given her age, it might be a good place to start.

[Hopeny]

Pardon my dumbness but are canker sores red gums or would there actually be a sore? I'm headed off to the ped again because I'm so freaked out

[LNN]

No, they're sores. But the baking soda was an idea in case the gums were inflamed due to some sort of infection/virus. Since it seems to help with canker sores, it seemed like a low risk idea to try.

[Hopeny]

Yes thank you I will try tonight. I've found Maalox to work on sores (she has from coxsackie before) but nothing has helped this time

[norcalmom]

DS has had gum issues, none currently, but persisted on and off for over a year.

If they are infected, you will most likely need to stop your current antibiotics and out on penicillin. Bacteria in the mouth are different. Aerobic vs anaerobic- and they respond only to the correct type of antibiotic.

We tried all the mouth swish stuff- didn't help. You may try gum with Xylitol - not sure it helps but my kid liked getting gum!

Also- I think the biggest help was vitamin D3. We realized that DSs levels were dropping, and he started high dose d3- - and his gums seemed to resolved within 3 - 4 weeks. I didn't start the HD d3 because of gum issues but when there seemed to be a correlation (takes a few weeks for the D3 to go up in blood) I researched and found a number of articles and studies on gum Heath and D3.

Good luck!

[Hopeny]

Norcalmom would amoxicillin work or does it need penicillin? I am making an appt with older dd's integrative and will bring up. Dd3 does have a D deficiency from Lyme I guess and I have just started 1000 IU daily. I'm annoyed with the dentist who knows she has an immune issue, insists its a systemic problem even though It started right after the cleaning , and thinks 24 hours of amoxicillin is enough. The one I used was past due expired but I really didn't anticipate the problem. Pediatrician doesn't want to treat it. It's upsetting seeing it and I know those types of infections can spread.

[norcalmom]

My sons had acute infection because he was picking at his gums,on top of the inflammation all along his gum line. The acute infection is why they gave him the antibiotics. First he had a deep cleaning- planing - that the periodontist recommended, in conjunction with nasty tasting antibiotic rinse. When that didn't work- they decided to use some antibiotics. He was on Doxy(and others- ) during this time, and they took him off those in favor of only penicillin. Plain, old penicillin. I think it was 10 days.

It worked for the acute infection, but the overall inflammation persisted on and off for a year afterward.,

He still occasionally will pick at them- according to him once every two weeks or so, when they feel weird.

There is gum inflammation connection with many things- immunological disorders, MS, diseases, heart issues, etc. google it.

Sorry no definitive answers, that's was our experience.

[Hopeny]

Thank you, I'm pretty sure the dentist stirred up something at the cleaning as her gums were fine before. I have another call into the dentist, and I will ask her for the penicillin. Pediatrician wants me to live with it unless she develops other symptoms.

[Hopeny]

Update: After making me wait two more weeks, so infected for like five weeks, and upon me telling her that DD stopped eating lunch at camp and was putting everything in mouth like teething, dentist suggested we do a deep scaling. So I say "Before we do something so invasive, could we try an antibiotic?" She suggests a rinse, I can't get 3 year old to rinse. So she agrees to give amox for a week. Tells me it will take 3 days to start working. Don't fall over, lo and behold day 3 we see about 50% improvement. Thank goodness she gave me the antibiotic but rhetorical question, why did she make me work so hard and kid wait so long to get it. I'm upset with my pediatrician too who I otherwise love, who said it wasn't bacterial. I am going to fax them and tell them it was in fact bacterial and the anitibiotic is clearing it up. Now I only hope 7 days is enough, or she will agree to give an extra week. It must have been very badly infected as it is still clearing.

[norcalmom]

My DS loved the deep cleaning and found it relaxing, just an FYI. Surprising.

Don't let any dentists give your child Nitrous Oxide- invade the have MTHFR cheched first. Some kids with MTHFR mutations cannot process the NO- so it u don't know, just say NO to NO.

They reported back that his teeth were really clean any way, which we kinda already knew, but they like to follow their protocols.

Glad something has worked for you.

[sf_mom]

Since your DD can't gargle..... I would also recommend rubbing ozonated Olive Oil on her gums to augment antibiotics. O2 Zap is a great brand.

 

We see a biomedical dentist that uses ozone as first line of defense for gum and sinus infections. It really, really works. However, its typically injected and a child her age could not tolerate the treatments. Sometimes they blow the ozone on gums and not inject which I think she could handle. Most biomedical dentist treat with ozone and are very versed at dealing with Lyme et al and its impact to teeth and gums.

 

Ozonated Olive Oil is also fantastic for almost any bruise or skin condition. Even clean ears and nose to clear or protect from ongoing infections.

[Hopeny]

NC mom the little one doesn't have either mthfr mutation but my older dd has one copy 677t. Son thanks for the tip on th olive oil, I will look I to that. I have been using baking soda and some antibacterial rinse on a qtip at night when she's asleep but it's only a small bit I can get on there. My next task is going to convince/insist on a second week of antibiotic. It's almost gone but not entirely. Interestingly she gave her the "Lyme" high dosage amoxicillin, three times a day not two.

Edited July 15, 2013 by Hopeny