Jump to content
ACN Latitudes Forums

Vaccine question: tetanus


Recommended Posts

So, I turned down a tetanus booster when I got stung by the stingray. And, I spoke to 2 doctors who didn't seem to care and thought that my risk was negligible anyway. I've had a bad reaction to it before so I turned it down. I was wondering if any of you have turned it down for yourself or for your children? Since I have a puncture wound, it mildly concerns me but since the docs said there was low low risk I am trying to tell myself I made the right decision. I know that many vaccines have thimerosal and I didn't want that coursing through my body. But, what about those that turn down vaccines for their children for a lifetime? Would there ever be a case where they would break down and give the vaccine?

 

Bonnie

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Bonnie,

 

For me, yes, there are circumstances that I would opt for a vaccine for myself or my children. It wouldn't be a matter of breaking "down though." (i'm not picking on you honestly i know exactly where that type of remark comes from, been there..done that!) An example, i'm still concerned about chicken pox for my boys who are older now and the complications for chicken pox increase as you age. Oldest son has had a couple of staph infections (staph is a danger with pox). I have been putting off titer testing, because I really didn't know what I would do if they came back without a level that is considered to confer immunity ( i don't believe these levels are necessarily the "end all" in "proving" protective immunity, but that's another subject). I have the order for titer testing here. Dr. (young guy, WAY different attitude than older Ped's). He didn't hassle me about "catching up" on immunizations for the boys, and told me if they didn't show immunity, that I might consider jumping right to the shingles vax. As others have pointed out here, the 2nd varicella vaccine is not going to give them long term protection from shingles, might even increase odds. The 2nd dose is not a guarantee that they won't get CP's in their 30' or 40' either. It isn't known how this is going to play out yet. I'm STILL struggling with it. CP vaccine doesn't contain aluminum or thimerosal, but it is a live viral vaccine that is injected rather than passing thru the normal barriers that the human body provides. What normal reactions are changed when that happens? Yet, i have to take (what i can possibly understand) about their immune function, liver health etc. and try to decide the lesser of two evils. My whole point here, is that each child, the history of reactions to other vaccines, the health of the child at the time, the use of anti biotics, the risks that a particular disease poses to a particular child ALL NEEDS to be taken into consideration when it comes to vaccination. That is not likely to happen. Profit potential is enormous when you develope a vaccine that is going to be injected into the masses, not individual children. Children with medical conditions are not allowed into the clinical trials, but once approved, everyone gets them (with rare exception). Does that make sense to anyone????

 

Wouldn't studies by unbiased (no financial conflicts of interests) be wonderful. Wouldn't it be great if these studies had been ongoing for years. What if it were proven that certain vaccines were safer than the natural illness for people with certain autoimmune conditions. My personal feeling is that there may be a resonable case to be made for certain vaccines for certain individuals, but the program as it stands is insane as far as i'm concerned.

 

Going to leave a copy regarding tetanus here, that I posted on the PANDAS forum recently. I think it spells out why a 6th tetanus containing vaccine is not a priority in my book for my boys. If they were to get a wound that was infected with feces, didn't bleed and had impaired circulatory function AND were severely magnesium deficient, i may consider the risk/reward substantial. As it stands, i'm much more concerned about them not wearing a helmet while riding a bike, them being hit by a driver that's talking on a cell phone, playing a sport on a field when you can hear thunder, or being harmed by a medical error.

 

previous post.....

 

 

I just have to share some things for your consideration regarding your concern about tetanus boosting. As always, do your own reseach!

 

It used to be that a tetanus/diptheria (TD) vaccine was used for boosting every 10 years. Since they have decided that 5 previous doses of any combo of DTP or the newer DTaP isn't enough to confer any long lasting protection from pertussis, they have gone to using the newer vax which supposedly can (magically ?) be safely given every 5 years instead of 10, regarding the tetanus portion anyway. If your daughter is fully vaccinated, she probably received some combo of DTaP at 2, 4, 6, months then again btwn 15 and 18 months, then again around the age of 5. The good news is that the older TD vaccine when drawn from a multidose vial, still contains mercury. The newer DTaP does not, but does contain alum, used to prompt an unnatural immune response. Alum is a known neurotoxin with no long term safety studies looking at the combined amts. used in the current vax schedule. So..this will be her SIXTH vax in this series.

 

If you consider that the incidence of tetanus was said to be btwn 500 and 600 hundred cases per year, prior to the infant immunization program in the late 1940's, well, it is an incredibly rare disease when considering the size of the population (when you consider the info below, is it really worth it?). I have included some info which is taken from an article talking about the older TD vaccine, but you will see how it talks about reactions being higher in "boosters" given after the primary series. Also, I've included an article which talks about "immunity" possibly being longer lasting than what we're currently lead to believe.

 

If I'm going to inject an neurologically sensitive person with antigen, metals, and other chemicals, I want to know there is a darn good reason for it. I will never forgive myself for allowing the Hep B birth dose and blindly injecting my babies/kids with every stupid thing that was put before me. Sorry, I start out calm and try to be so objective, but I end up angry most times, so I'm going to shut up now!

 

bolding mine

 

http://74.125.95.132/search?q=cache:pWvwMf...=clnk&gl=us

 

 

QUOTE

Secular Trends in the United States A marked decrease in mortality from tetanus occurred from the early 1900s to the late 1940s. In the late 1940s, tetanus toxoid was introduced into routine childhood immuniza­tion and tetanus became nationally notifiable. At that time, 500–600 cases (approximately 0.4 cases per 100,000 population) were reported per year. After the 1940s, reported tetanus incidence rates declined steadily. Since the mid-1970s, 50–100 cases (0.05 cases per 100,000) have been reported annually. The death-to-case ratio has declined from 30% to approximately 10% in recent years. An all-time low of 20 cases (0.01 cases per 100,000) were reported in 2003

 

 

 

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art...rticlekey=85107

 

Study: Immune System Has Long Memory

 

http://www.rxlist.com/diptheria-and-tetanus-drug.htm

 

 

NERVOUS SYSTEM

 

The following neurologic illnesses have been reported as temporally associated with vaccine containing tetanus toxoid: neurological complications14 including cochlear lesion,15 brachial plexus neuropathies,15,16 paralysis of the radial nerve,17 paralysis of the recurrent nerve,15 accommodation paresis, Guillain-Barré syndrome (GBS),and EEG disturbances with encephalopathy.18 The IOM following review of the reports of neurologic events following vaccination with tetanus toxoid, Td or DT, concluded the evidence favored acceptance of a causal relationship between tetanus toxoid and brachial neuritis and GBS.9,19

 

 

and

 

There is an increased incidence of local and systemic reactions to booster doses of tetanus toxoid when given to previously immunized persons

 

and

 

The occurrence of tetanus in the US has decreased dramatically from 560 reported cases in 1947 to a record low of 48 reported cases in 1987. Tetanus in the US is primarily a disease of older adults. Of 99 tetanus patients with complete information reported to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) during 1987 and 1988,68% were =50 years of age, while only six were < 20 years of age. Overall, the case-fatality rate was 21%.2 In 1992, 45 cases were reported of which 82% were =50 years of age.6 The disease continues to occur almost exclusively among persons who are unvaccinated or inadequately vaccinated or whose vaccination histories are unknown or uncertain.

 

 

A history of systemic allergic or neurologic reactions following a previous dose of DT is an absolute contraindication for further use.2

 

Adverse reactions may be local and include redness, warmth, edema, induration, with or without tenderness, as well as urticaria, and rash. Malaise, transient fever, pain, hypotension, nausea and arthralgia may develop in some patients after the injection. Arthus-type hypersensitivity reactions, characterized by severe local reactions (generally starting 2 to 8 hours after an injection) may occur, particularly in persons who have received multiple prior boosters.2

 

Rarely, an anaphylactic reaction (i.e., hives, swelling of the mouth, difficulty breathing, hypotension, or shock) and death have been reported after receiving preparations containing diphtheria and tetanus antigens.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Bonnie,

 

think you caught before I edited out the part about youngest recent wart thing. I decided i was going off in too many directions again and decided to leave that out but i screwed it up and it went with original ^_^

 

bet you wondered where that came from at the bottom of the first post!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, Kim, in other words ^_^ ....you probably wouldn't give the tetanus booster!

It's funny but I found a homeopathic website that stated that you should still follow orthodox medicine and give the tetanus boosters and follow their plan. Then they stated that hyperconium(st. john's wort) can be used against tetanus/lock jaw. I found it odd that a homeopathic doctor would encourage his readers to follow orthodox medicine. although, my naturopath thought it was a good thing that I went on an antibiotic to prevent infection. Turns out he had a patient who developed secondary infection after a stingray sting in Mexico and he had to cut out the pus and drain it, etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, Kim, in other words ^_^ ....you probably wouldn't give the tetanus booster!

It's funny but I found a homeopathic website that stated that you should still follow orthodox medicine and give the tetanus boosters and follow their plan. Then they stated that hyperconium(st. john's wort) can be used against tetanus/lock jaw. I found it odd that a homeopathic doctor would encourage his readers to follow orthodox medicine. although, my naturopath thought it was a good thing that I went on an antibiotic to prevent infection. Turns out he had a patient who developed secondary infection after a stingray sting in Mexico and he had to cut out the pus and drain it, etc.

 

ilovedog,

 

i have just studied the 2 remedies, Ledum & Hypericum from my school. for acute injuries fr puncture wound from sharp instructmts, poisonous bites & stings (insets, dogs, snakes), you would use Ledum to prevent tetanus shoot. now, if you don't find relieve from it, then you can use hypericum to avoid tetanus & lock jaw. the symptoms that lead you to use hypericum is shooting upward nerve pain. however, there are also other remedies that can be used after ledum depending on your symptoms.

 

from what i learned, if ledum is prescribed correctly, you can avoid the shoot because the remedy can replace it. there is no point in taking the remedy & getting a shoot. or if you decided to get the shoot, i would not take the remedy because that would be unnecessary.

 

i am not giving advise, just want to pass on the info from what i know. hope this is helpful.

 

Pat

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, do you use the ledum for now just in case? My naturopath told me that I already missed the window for getting the shot anyway and that I shouldn't bother getting the tetanus shot. He used to work for pharmaceutical companies as a chemist so I know he speaks truth when he says to steer clear of certain things. He did tell me to get on antibiotics, though, so he's not totally against orthodox meds.

 

Bonnie

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ilovedog,

 

it is hard to say if ledum is the correct remedy for you because you had the wound awhile ago, and your state, and signs & symptoms may have changed. also, for acute cases, it is important to match the potency to your vital force, so you may need a higher potency like a 200C or higher which you can't obtain from your local health food store. if the potency is not strong enough, it may work for a short while and stops working.

 

for something serious like a poisonous stingray, i would consult a homeopath or take the antibiotic as suggested by your ND. i wonder if grapefruit seed extract would work in this case?! grapefruit seed extract can be used to eradicate strep, so that may be an option for you.

 

Pat

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Bonnie,

 

For me, yes, there are circumstances that I would opt for a vaccine for myself or my children. It wouldn't be a matter of breaking "down though." (i'm not picking on you honestly i know exactly where that type of remark comes from, been there..done that!) An example, i'm still concerned about chicken pox for my boys who are older now and the complications for chicken pox increase as you age. Oldest son has had a couple of staph infections (staph is a danger with pox). I have been putting off titer testing, because I really didn't know what I would do if they came back without a level that is considered to confer immunity ( i don't believe these levels are necessarily the "end all" in "proving" protective immunity, but that's another subject). I have the order for titer testing here. Dr. (young guy, WAY different attitude than older Ped's). He didn't hassle me about "catching up" on immunizations for the boys, and told me if they didn't show immunity, that I might consider jumping right to the shingles vax. As others have pointed out here, the 2nd varicella vaccine is not going to give them long term protection from shingles, might even increase odds. The 2nd dose is not a guarantee that they won't get CP's in their 30' or 40' either. It isn't known how this is going to play out yet. I'm STILL struggling with it. CP vaccine doesn't contain aluminum or thimerosal, but it is a live viral vaccine that is injected rather than passing thru the normal barriers that the human body provides. What normal reactions are changed when that happens? Yet, i have to take (what i can possibly understand) about their immune function, liver health etc. and try to decide the lesser of two evils. My whole point here, is that each child, the history of reactions to other vaccines, the health of the child at the time, the use of anti biotics, the risks that a particular disease poses to a particular child ALL NEEDS to be taken into consideration when it comes to vaccination. That is not likely to happen. Profit potential is enormous when you develope a vaccine that is going to be injected into the masses, not individual children. Children with medical conditions are not allowed into the clinical trials, but once approved, everyone gets them (with rare exception). Does that make sense to anyone????

 

Wouldn't studies by unbiased (no financial conflicts of interests) be wonderful. Wouldn't it be great if these studies had been ongoing for years. What if it were proven that certain vaccines were safer than the natural illness for people with certain autoimmune conditions. My personal feeling is that there may be a resonable case to be made for certain vaccines for certain individuals, but the program as it stands is insane as far as i'm concerned.

 

Going to leave a copy regarding tetanus here, that I posted on the PANDAS forum recently. I think it spells out why a 6th tetanus containing vaccine is not a priority in my book for my boys. If they were to get a wound that was infected with feces, didn't bleed and had impaired circulatory function AND were severely magnesium deficient, i may consider the risk/reward substantial. As it stands, i'm much more concerned about them not wearing a helmet while riding a bike, them being hit by a driver that's talking on a cell phone, playing a sport on a field when you can hear thunder, or being harmed by a medical error.

 

previous post.....

 

 

I just have to share some things for your consideration regarding your concern about tetanus boosting. As always, do your own reseach!

 

It used to be that a tetanus/diptheria (TD) vaccine was used for boosting every 10 years. Since they have decided that 5 previous doses of any combo of DTP or the newer DTaP isn't enough to confer any long lasting protection from pertussis, they have gone to using the newer vax which supposedly can (magically ?) be safely given every 5 years instead of 10, regarding the tetanus portion anyway. If your daughter is fully vaccinated, she probably received some combo of DTaP at 2, 4, 6, months then again btwn 15 and 18 months, then again around the age of 5. The good news is that the older TD vaccine when drawn from a multidose vial, still contains mercury. The newer DTaP does not, but does contain alum, used to prompt an unnatural immune response. Alum is a known neurotoxin with no long term safety studies looking at the combined amts. used in the current vax schedule. So..this will be her SIXTH vax in this series.

 

If you consider that the incidence of tetanus was said to be btwn 500 and 600 hundred cases per year, prior to the infant immunization program in the late 1940's, well, it is an incredibly rare disease when considering the size of the population (when you consider the info below, is it really worth it?). I have included some info which is taken from an article talking about the older TD vaccine, but you will see how it talks about reactions being higher in "boosters" given after the primary series. Also, I've included an article which talks about "immunity" possibly being longer lasting than what we're currently lead to believe.

 

If I'm going to inject an neurologically sensitive person with antigen, metals, and other chemicals, I want to know there is a darn good reason for it. I will never forgive myself for allowing the Hep B birth dose and blindly injecting my babies/kids with every stupid thing that was put before me. Sorry, I start out calm and try to be so objective, but I end up angry most times, so I'm going to shut up now!

 

bolding mine

 

http://74.125.95.132/search?q=cache:pWvwMf...=clnk&gl=us

 

 

QUOTE

Secular Trends in the United States A marked decrease in mortality from tetanus occurred from the early 1900s to the late 1940s. In the late 1940s, tetanus toxoid was introduced into routine childhood immuniza­tion and tetanus became nationally notifiable. At that time, 500–600 cases (approximately 0.4 cases per 100,000 population) were reported per year. After the 1940s, reported tetanus incidence rates declined steadily. Since the mid-1970s, 50–100 cases (0.05 cases per 100,000) have been reported annually. The death-to-case ratio has declined from 30% to approximately 10% in recent years. An all-time low of 20 cases (0.01 cases per 100,000) were reported in 2003

 

 

 

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art...rticlekey=85107

 

Study: Immune System Has Long Memory

 

http://www.rxlist.com/diptheria-and-tetanus-drug.htm

 

 

NERVOUS SYSTEM

 

The following neurologic illnesses have been reported as temporally associated with vaccine containing tetanus toxoid: neurological complications14 including cochlear lesion,15 brachial plexus neuropathies,15,16 paralysis of the radial nerve,17 paralysis of the recurrent nerve,15 accommodation paresis, Guillain-Barré syndrome (GBS),and EEG disturbances with encephalopathy.18 The IOM following review of the reports of neurologic events following vaccination with tetanus toxoid, Td or DT, concluded the evidence favored acceptance of a causal relationship between tetanus toxoid and brachial neuritis and GBS.9,19

 

 

and

 

There is an increased incidence of local and systemic reactions to booster doses of tetanus toxoid when given to previously immunized persons

 

and

 

The occurrence of tetanus in the US has decreased dramatically from 560 reported cases in 1947 to a record low of 48 reported cases in 1987. Tetanus in the US is primarily a disease of older adults. Of 99 tetanus patients with complete information reported to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) during 1987 and 1988,68% were =50 years of age, while only six were < 20 years of age. Overall, the case-fatality rate was 21%.2 In 1992, 45 cases were reported of which 82% were =50 years of age.6 The disease continues to occur almost exclusively among persons who are unvaccinated or inadequately vaccinated or whose vaccination histories are unknown or uncertain.

 

 

A history of systemic allergic or neurologic reactions following a previous dose of DT is an absolute contraindication for further use.2

 

Adverse reactions may be local and include redness, warmth, edema, induration, with or without tenderness, as well as urticaria, and rash. Malaise, transient fever, pain, hypotension, nausea and arthralgia may develop in some patients after the injection. Arthus-type hypersensitivity reactions, characterized by severe local reactions (generally starting 2 to 8 hours after an injection) may occur, particularly in persons who have received multiple prior boosters.2

 

Rarely, an anaphylactic reaction (i.e., hives, swelling of the mouth, difficulty breathing, hypotension, or shock) and death have been reported after receiving preparations containing diphtheria and tetanus antigens.

Hi Kim, I am in the same boat as you as far as the CP vaccine. My daughter last check up they requested that she receive the second CP vaccine and I told the doctor my reasons for not wanting her to get it. I requested for the titers and she told me to wait for her next year blood work but she also asked why and asked what I would do if she needed the CP vaccine. I told her I don't know and I am so mad at myself for letting her get that shot. I remember at the time I was unsure and they talked me into it. I watched four of her friends when they had the chicken pox and prayed my daughter would get even thow she had the vaccine. I worry alot about all these decisions we have to make and if they are the correct ones.

 

Has anyone child had the CP Vaccine and had bad reaction.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ilovedog,

 

it is hard to say if ledum is the correct remedy for you because you had the wound awhile ago, and your state, and signs & symptoms may have changed. also, for acute cases, it is important to match the potency to your vital force, so you may need a higher potency like a 200C or higher which you can't obtain from your local health food store. if the potency is not strong enough, it may work for a short while and stops working.

 

for something serious like a poisonous stingray, i would consult a homeopath or take the antibiotic as suggested by your ND. i wonder if grapefruit seed extract would work in this case?! grapefruit seed extract can be used to eradicate strep, so that may be an option for you.

 

Pat

That's funny b/c the day after I got stung I started coming down with a mild cold and I took grapefruit seed extract(I found it at a natural food store in FL). I didn't continue taking it. Are you saying that I should take it orally or use it topically? Right now I have a charcoal poultice on the wound area to pull toxins or bacteria to the surface. Don't know if it works but it sure feels good b/c I soaked it in an epsom salts bath with some tea tree oil added in! Right now my naturopath just wants me to keep an eye on it. He had a patient a few weeks ago who had a stingray sting get infected and he had to cut out the infection, etc. But, she hadn't taken any antibiotics or been as careful as I have been!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ilovedog,

 

i would follow the advise of your ND. BTW, what does he recommend at this point. i know you can use GSE topically & internally. for an externally wound, i would think it may be better to apply it topically. i believe you must dilute the GSE and not put drops on the wound becuz it will burn.

 

elderberry extract is antivirus, so it is very good for colds if it is viral.

 

pat

Link to comment
Share on other sites

i wonder if grapefruit seed extract would work in this case?! grapefruit seed extract can be used to eradicate strep, so that may be an option for you.

 

Pat

 

just a word of caution as grapeFRUIT seed extract (as opposed to grapeseed extract) is known to have some interactions with medications so please anyone reading this who has themselves or a child on prescription meds, check with your physician first before using grapeFRUIT seed extract

 

https://www.health.harvard.edu/fhg/updates/update0206d.shtml

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...