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treating autism with antibiotics


EAMom
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did the video say what percentage (I watched it 1x) of kids responded to this protocol?

 

and I wonder how many of these kids were

1) autistic with 2ndary PANDAS--->symptoms improved

2) all PANDAS (misdiagnosed as autistic)-->symptoms improved

3) autistic with no PANDAS --->symptoms improved with resolution of infection or is some other factor at play? (immune modulation/anti-inflammatory of antibiotics)

 

??????

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I only watched once as well. But my impression was that he was lyme, misdiagnosed as autism. The docs then go on to generalize to many bacteria and the potential of abx, that the symptoms can be triggered by more than lyme.

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I only watched once as well. But my impression was that he was lyme, misdiagnosed as autism. The docs then go on to generalize to many bacteria and the potential of abx, that the symptoms can be triggered by more than lyme.

Okay, yup. I watched it again.

 

The first boy (Alexandre) had Lyme (autistic symptoms plus other symptoms). When they treated the Lyme (for the other symptoms presumeably), the autism also went away.

 

Now this scientist is looking for other microbes (not just Lyme) in these kids, and treating with antibiotics. So, not all the kids (presumeably) that respond to abs have Lyme. The video said that 4/5 autistic kids (200 so far) have responded to this treatment. I don't know how many of these were prescreened for infections first and if you just took autistic kids (not screened for infection) if you'd still have 80% of them improving.

 

One key element that seems apparent, is that the "typical" 10 day course of Amoxicilllin isn't going to do much in these kids (like many PANDAS kids)...they need a longer course.

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Wow. Thanks for posting. You are on the ball! It sure would be great if this was actually published, then perhaps main stream doctors would pay more attention and think to treat for infection. My DD10 lost her speech at 16 months (after MMR vax), was able to regain it after 4 years private speech therapy, but remained socially immature, Dx with ADHD, motor/vocal tic disorder, aspergers, gross motor delay, probable PANDAS according to the pediatric psychologist (exacerbations with strep, and after a while, viruses as well). She has always had dark circles under her eyes which resolve along with all other symptoms while on combination antibiotics.

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I only watched once as well. But my impression was that he was lyme, misdiagnosed as autism. The docs then go on to generalize to many bacteria and the potential of abx, that the symptoms can be triggered by more than lyme.

 

 

I would agree with you, but what I am finding in my practice is that almost every one of the autistic kids I treat end up highly suspicious to me of having something infectious...sudden onset, parents who have or have had similar symptoms, were sick when they got immunized, etc. Even the kids who were "born" with it many times have parents with immune problems, had symptoms of PANS in the past, etc.

 

Personally, I am beginning to think that the majority of autism is infectious. Good example...DS19 was treated with abx, and some of his symptoms went away (at 15.) From 18 - 19, he was treated with IVIG, and after the 2nd dose, his social skills jumped multiple years...overnight! He is diagnosed with asperger's syndrome.

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I only watched once as well. But my impression was that he was lyme, misdiagnosed as autism. The docs then go on to generalize to many bacteria and the potential of abx, that the symptoms can be triggered by more than lyme.

 

 

I would agree with you, but what I am finding in my practice is that almost every one of the autistic kids I treat end up highly suspicious to me of having something infectious...sudden onset, parents who have or have had similar symptoms, were sick when they got immunized, etc. Even the kids who were "born" with it many times have parents with immune problems, had symptoms of PANS in the past, etc.

 

Personally, I am beginning to think that the majority of autism is infectious. Good example...DS19 was treated with abx, and some of his symptoms went away (at 15.) From 18 - 19, he was treated with IVIG, and after the 2nd dose, his social skills jumped multiple years...overnight! He is diagnosed with asperger's syndrome.

 

yeah...I was wondering if these kids would also benefit from HD IVIG

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I only watched once as well. But my impression was that he was lyme, misdiagnosed as autism. The docs then go on to generalize to many bacteria and the potential of abx, that the symptoms can be triggered by more than lyme.

 

 

I would agree with you, but what I am finding in my practice is that almost every one of the autistic kids I treat end up highly suspicious to me of having something infectious...sudden onset, parents who have or have had similar symptoms, were sick when they got immunized, etc. Even the kids who were "born" with it many times have parents with immune problems, had symptoms of PANS in the past, etc.

 

Personally, I am beginning to think that the majority of autism is infectious. Good example...DS19 was treated with abx, and some of his symptoms went away (at 15.) From 18 - 19, he was treated with IVIG, and after the 2nd dose, his social skills jumped multiple years...overnight! He is diagnosed with asperger's syndrome.

 

But T potter there must be more to it than that? Infections and immunomodulatory therapy, otherwise wouldn't your son no longer be on the spectrum at all? There clearly must be A LOT of genetic abnormalities in these children. A lot of kids have Lyme and strep without problems. There have also been studies done showing structural abnormalities in autistic brains. These kids are "different" infection/ immune mediated or not.

Edited by LaurenK
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I only watched once as well. But my impression was that he was lyme, misdiagnosed as autism. The docs then go on to generalize to many bacteria and the potential of abx, that the symptoms can be triggered by more than lyme.

 

 

I would agree with you, but what I am finding in my practice is that almost every one of the autistic kids I treat end up highly suspicious to me of having something infectious...sudden onset, parents who have or have had similar symptoms, were sick when they got immunized, etc. Even the kids who were "born" with it many times have parents with immune problems, had symptoms of PANS in the past, etc.

 

Personally, I am beginning to think that the majority of autism is infectious. Good example...DS19 was treated with abx, and some of his symptoms went away (at 15.) From 18 - 19, he was treated with IVIG, and after the 2nd dose, his social skills jumped multiple years...overnight! He is diagnosed with asperger's syndrome.

 

But T potter there must be more to it than that? Infections and immunomodulatory therapy, otherwise wouldn't your son no longer be on the spectrum at all? There clearly must be A LOT of genetic abnormalities in these children. A lot of kids have Lyme and strep without problems. There have also been studies done showing structural abnormalities in autistic brains. These kids are "different" infection/ immune mediated or not.

 

certainly many factors would come into play

-genetics/individual susceptability

-nutrtional issues (eg vitamin d) http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=vitamin-d-and-autism

-age at which infection strikes

-whether infection is chronic

-cummultive effect of triggers (eg multiple infections on top of vaccines)

-underlying immune problems

-specific type of infection (eg. a virulant strain of strep)

-other-eg toxins in environment, tylenol given with vaccines http://www.foodconsumer.org/newsite/Non-food/Drug/tylenol_linked_to_increased_risk_of_autism_0702101053.html

-and perhaps the hygeine hypothesis is also a factor (too sterile an environment in infancy, so kids are more prone to immune issues, allergies/autism etc) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2048743/

-hormones? (more autism in boys)

 

and then the question is, what came first, the chicken or the egg. Do these kids have "different" immune systems due to the chronic untreated infections (think of a PANDAS kid who develops autoimmunity secondary to strep, then reacts to many other triggers). Or is it the "different" immune system that is at the root of it all.

Edited by EAMom
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I just spoke to a geneticist a few weeks ago regarding some abnormalitises in my ds. She's been working on the genome project the last 10yrs to try to find a genetic link to autism and so far it has been elusive! Initially, they thought it would be easy to establish, just test the blood of 100 kids with autism and see the similarities, but no, still looking for it!

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interesting statement about intestinal mucuosa, when inflammation is present, the infection seeps through the mucuosa into the bloodstream, and the toxins can reach the brain. I know there was a pandas symposium a while back, but what about a microbe-triggered neuro symposium--non-specific for the outcome. Meaning, whether it's autism, lupus, tourette's, pans---just get all these docs from all over the world together to put all the pieces of the puzzle together. I know they are out there. We, as moms and dads, are always finding this little piece or that little piece, and I'm sure it's not only me who keeps saying to myself "THAT HAS GOT TO BE A PIECE TO THIS PUZZLE!!" The symposium could work together to make the box cover to the puzzle.......yah, I'll get right on planning that one :blink:

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I only watched once as well. But my impression was that he was lyme, misdiagnosed as autism. The docs then go on to generalize to many bacteria and the potential of abx, that the symptoms can be triggered by more than lyme.

 

 

I would agree with you, but what I am finding in my practice is that almost every one of the autistic kids I treat end up highly suspicious to me of having something infectious...sudden onset, parents who have or have had similar symptoms, were sick when they got immunized, etc. Even the kids who were "born" with it many times have parents with immune problems, had symptoms of PANS in the past, etc.

 

Personally, I am beginning to think that the majority of autism is infectious. Good example...DS19 was treated with abx, and some of his symptoms went away (at 15.) From 18 - 19, he was treated with IVIG, and after the 2nd dose, his social skills jumped multiple years...overnight! He is diagnosed with asperger's syndrome.

 

But T potter there must be more to it than that? Infections and immunomodulatory therapy, otherwise wouldn't your son no longer be on the spectrum at all? There clearly must be A LOT of genetic abnormalities in these children. A lot of kids have Lyme and strep without problems. There have also been studies done showing structural abnormalities in autistic brains. These kids are "different" infection/ immune mediated or not.

 

 

I'm sure it all plays together. DS19 also has the MTHFR 677T gene mutation. Could that play a role? Are there other mutations that he has that I haven't identified? etc, etc. Just like not everyone gets PANS, maybe the symptoms of these Autistic kids is brought on by infection. Keep in mind that autism is only a name to explain a certain set of symptoms: sensory, language and social skill deficits. DAN doctors are treating biomedically, and some doctors, including Dr. B. are treating Autistic kids with immunomodulators (IVIG.) Many, like my DS are responding. I wonder if it's so hard to find the genetic link, because maybe there isn't one...just the fact that the parents were sick, passed it on, and the children had autoimmune responses to infection. And, here's another theory...there are so many more immunizations our kids get these days...they are doubled, tripled, even 5 at a time...given regardless of whether or not the child is sick...all because the AAP says they have to be given on a certain schedule. Immunizations, by nature, control the immune system, so if the child's immune system is already out of whack...how's that going to affect the child when s/he gets the immunization? This is just my opinion.

 

Also, in response to the gut mucosa, it is very common for kids with autism to have stomach problems...leaky gut syndrome is a common one.

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I've posted this before - it's a VERY long discussion on biofilms - not specific to one disease but on how it plays a role in many, many chronic health issues. There may be times you wade thru parts of this, but it is well worth the effort to read the whole thing.

http://bacteriality.com/2008/05/26/biofilm/

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